token
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Post by token on Apr 12, 2017 8:12:34 GMT 10
I have a theory, bear with me for a mini.
I recently sold a block of land, 24acres. Its right away from the city, in a completely different environment than what most city folk might be used to, and at first, it would be a place that might generally turn them off. Its seasonal, and its not the rain foresty areas of qld. Its dry and dusty, anyone's guess on when it rains, doesn't get the feed on the ground like the south, but its cheap, and unless your country, or haven't stayed long enough, you wont see its beauty amidst all this and its potential.
Yet, i had staggering amounts of people coming from the city whom most all told me they had had enough and wanted out of the city or the burbs surrounding such.
When i drive to this area, all i see is more traffic, hear of more crime and serious safety issues, see more instant suburbs being built and realize that you need a whole lot more money to live in this place just for parking and travelling on the roads. You need a whole lot more time for that travel and thus you need a whole lot more patience. Then we run back to our box, where we keep out voices down lest the neighbour hears us, we keep our prepping low key lest others find out and in a situation end up ransacking our shed or breaking a window in the kids room to get a feed.
Now, admittedly, this might not happen and you might be doing alright, but where more people are you have to admit that it creates more risk in a societal breakdown of sorts.
I see vacant areas a good ways out from these places still only bearing a few homes here and there, suddenly becoming boom areas too, and prices going up. And i have a lot of friends who cannot break their attachment to the genre of area they live. Yet they suffer for it in all the above ive spoken and its only getting busier and more populated all the time.
Some people think, 'i need to get X amount of money though and my job provides that (say $1200 per week), yet some of the jobs 30-45 minutes drive from where i live might only pay $800 a week. This is a turn off for some of my friends, but then i explain to them, your paying $350 upwards rent on this suburban box though, so take that down to $150-$200 per week where i am, and sometimes with 3 acres of land. Thus, you might be getting more money, but your just giving that to someone else.
Couple that with the price you need to take in mortgage for a house out that way $350K upwards, when you can get a place in the quiet urban area of a small town for $75K at times. Or $200k will get your upwards of 20acres as well with a house.
Just think, 10:30pm late night shed grinding and welding and banging without the cops turning up or the neighbour screaming at you, more room for the kids, more privacy, a hobby farm if you want it, bigger sheds, sometimes a bigger home (the old weatherboard houses had huge rooms and high ceilings), more adventure, more room to prep, off the grid if you want it. Less stress and the possibility that you can achieve the ultimate prep, pay the darn bank back and own it, as you arent locked in for those bigger amounts in the more built up and popular areas.
In respect to travel for work or stocks. I would easily end up on the road for 1hr to get only so far in those areas, and yet folk get upset when they realize a major town for aldi might be 45-1.5hrs away lol. There's no difference, just a whole lot more scenery and smooth travel to get to my destination.
In respect to work. Im really shocked at how many jobs there are in a town of 2500. Utterly shocked to be really honest with you. My friends moved up and 3 of them got full time work that they love, inside of 2 weeks.....in the town!
So my thoughts to anyone here who might feel stuck like my wife and i did and some of our friends do is. Consider breaking out of what you think you need and take a look right away from a city area. Nothing like country for the kids to play in.
Any other questions ill be happy to answer so long as OPSEC isnt compromised too much, but folks, if there's preppers stuck in the burbs, id love to have you out our ways. Got a few out here now.
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Post by Peter on Apr 12, 2017 9:35:13 GMT 10
Finding work has always been my biggest concern about moving to the country. I've always worked for myself, so I admit that working for someone else would be a real challenge for me.
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feralemma
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Post by feralemma on Apr 12, 2017 9:44:16 GMT 10
Finding work has always been my biggest concern about moving to the country. I've always worked for myself, so I admit that working for someone else would be a real challenge for me. I think that depends on what you do for a job. There's a lot of services that are seriously lacking in rural areas so you may still be able to work for yourself!
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grumble
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Post by grumble on Apr 12, 2017 9:58:09 GMT 10
Interesting I already travel 110klm return trip each day for work or nearly 2 hours I am fortunate enough to have 75 acres 45 min from the CBD of a capitol city so I have all the critical service at my finger tips yet I am still able to do all the things I like , like walk out my front door and go shooting or work in my workshop until ungodly hours of the morning and by completing all the projects I am doing on my property now I avoid all the council red tap that will come over time but for now they have removed a whole bunch of it to encourage people to build and develop their land things like no longer needing a permit to erect a shed of up to 6m in size or a free standing carport little things but hey there has been an explosion now of fully lined "wood sheds " or "storage sheds "being erected on vacant land without interference from local government
My brother on the other hand lives in the middle of a barren scorched part of hell called the Australian outback in a small country town that clings to life by simply being the only town for a very long time life there is simple but brutal and not for the faint of heart a couple of summers ago their hottest day was unofficially 51.8c they had a wonderful 9 months and 17 days of cloud free skies that also meant no rain for 10 months Now I will say if you can survive the heat the dust the floods the mozzies the flies and the isolation plus being cut off for weeks during the wet season and the fact that the nearest hospital that can treat anything more than a basic injury being 7 hours away land there is pretty cheap and there is work around if you can handle all the above also factor in groceries are 3 times the price of on the coast and fuel is very pricey well in fact everything costs a lot more due to transport cost
I did my time in places like that and yes they are ok but now for me prepping is not for me anymore its for my children and in all fairness I can not in good faith move them into some backwards place that will only disadvantage and prevent them from reaching their full potential due to a lack of resources and access to the basic things for their development in a world that is only going to get harder and more demanding on the requirements for its work force
My point is people really need to do their research 1st to see what they gain for what they lose to see if the trade offs are worth it or is it a short term gain for a long term loss because quite often its harder to reverse the journey once its started. Lessoned learned the hard way I move from a place that I used to live at I loved the life style there ( didn't know what I had till it wasn't there ) but I needed to go see other things now I can never afford to move back there and I probably never will as the price of land their has gone far beyond the reach of reasonable people to give an example I sold my old house there for $150K well last year I saw it had sold for $900k so at this point I couldn't even buy my old home back if I wanted to this is something to think about when looking at moving out of town so to speak
Now in fairness places like where my brother lives would probably do quite well if the world went to hell in a hand basket because they already live without a lot of the luxury and convenience that the more populated locations along the coast are use to
Myself personally I am looking more towards moving closer into the city in the next 5 to 8 years and having a weekend property as a retreat so I can let my children have access to all the vital infrastructure to be educated and to educate themselves plus for their personal development because while its good to encourage their outdoor activities and give them skills in bushcraft they still need to be able to pursue dreams of being doctors or pilots or in my sons case he soooo wants to be a car doctor or a MotoX rider
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paranoia
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Post by paranoia on Apr 12, 2017 12:22:09 GMT 10
Couldn't agree more token. The cost benefit is difficult to wrap your head around for some, especially those facing lower wages. My mortgage payments are $260 a week less, Council rates $600 a year less... that's $14,000 a year better off, after tax! I can afford to take a lower paying job if I wanted to or work less hours.
There's also electricity bills, despite paying 10c a kwh more and moving from gas to electric stove/oven (oven is huge for us, my wife does a lot of baking) my power bills are nearly half what they were... you just spend more time outside when you have acres instead of square meters.
A bit over 3 years ago I moved from suburban Perth to rural SA. I'm only an hour and a half out of the CBD but its a different world. In the way people treat each other, how people know each other... It genuinely shocked me when I first moved here.
As for services, the small town I live 5 minutes away from (500 people) has a take away shop, a pub, a doctor/pharmacy 6 hours a week, a general store, a bakery, a post office, a primary school (40 students), state linked library & community centre/hall. There's a bigger town 20 minutes away with proper supermarkets, petrol stations, hospital ect... and a large one 40 minutes away with everything you'd need.
Unless you've got a terminal condition, just how often do you need the doctor? Most services that were an issue for rural people in days past can be done online now... I've even got NBN.
I've even found advantage to being away from the larger shops, it forces you to buy less frequently in bulk. You also spend less money buying stuff you don't need.
I've found life is just overall better out of the suburbs/city, from the pace things move at to the close knit community. I'll put up with 10 hours driving through beautiful scenery a week for that and I'm not sure I could go back.
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token
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Post by token on Apr 12, 2017 19:48:39 GMT 10
As more people cant afford $600k to $1mil for a modest 3 bedroom house on tbe coast, they will start buying out west and push the prices up there. So better to buy sooner than later. I've seen rural land triple in price over 10 years. Dead right Frost, that was part of my theory but i hit the post button and didnt get to the point. I believe prices out my way are going to increase given the serious amount of responses of how people, although not all being preppers, were expressing lack of family time, too much time at work, no room, traffic, pollution, dangers and more, and they were all wanting out of it, but seemed to lack country experience. The biggest question i got was 'where is the water?'. Although it was on the advert, i responded again...'its in the sky, or the dam, you need to get water tanks and erect structures to capture it'. People are not used to living away from the system that is in many cases not only poisoning the water system, but extremely fragile and susceptible to attacks in this day and age. I made over 20k profit on my block of land in 3.5years, and i was offered more at the last minute by another couple when the contract for the other buyers was in the mail, so i would have made more if i had of had a lack of honor and integrity. Yer that would be difficult i agree. Can you give me an idea on what you do though? As out my way, 2 hours drive is 'local'. Where i am however, within 1.5hrs you have two of the largest inland cities in Vic, id be surprised if you couldnt fit in, but then again. As feralemma said, there can be a lack of competition in rural areas and or a niche that could take off. Yes agreed, people need to research, but they need to also have an open mind in other areas otherwise they might end up putting 'their initial desires' as they seem them first. We couldn't care less for all the huge variety of shops and cinemas and so on that we once had at our convenience, but if we want a fix we just travel out a bit now and then. You save more money anyways. Your brother sounds like hes right out there, we arent though, but i wouldn't want to be as close as you are to a major city as i believe those areas will be developed faster in many areas. I want to ensure that my kids don't end up having too many troubles with built up areas, but i might be wrong. A lot of rural towns have plenty though too. We have a grocery store, hospital, small cinema, lawyers, fuel stations, sports store, banks, pubs, firebrigade, parks, tip, take away stores, gun shop, home hardware and more. Yes agreed too mate, i have found the same.
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gasman
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Post by gasman on Apr 13, 2017 7:52:52 GMT 10
Once u hit that rural lifestyle you'll never ever go back to suburbia Prepping self sufficiency food production etc gets so much easier Even only a small block it's amazing what u can do Certainly keeps u busy and fit
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gasman
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Post by gasman on Apr 13, 2017 7:55:30 GMT 10
Once u hit that rural lifestyle you'll never ever go back to suburbia Prepping self sufficiency food production etc gets so much easier Even only a small block it's amazing what u can do Certainly keeps u busy and fit
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gasman
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Post by gasman on Apr 13, 2017 8:18:21 GMT 10
Once u hit that rural lifestyle you'll never ever go back to suburbia Prepping self sufficiency food production etc gets so much easier Even only a small block it's amazing what u can do Certainly keeps u busy and fit A side effect of rural lifestyle is patchy internet that drops out and you post twice😗
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Beno
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Post by Beno on Apr 13, 2017 13:05:02 GMT 10
i know for a fact that many small towns don't bother advertising jobs cause they can post in a paper, internet or what ever and get no interest at all for months and even years. Better to door knock in these areas as you'll be surprised what is available to the right person. This is particularly the case with some "professional" jobs in a local council. when i've moved to remote locations my missus has picked up great jobs within two weeks, regularly. i was always surprised the number of vacant positions with gov, business, farming that can't be filled cause there is no max brenner or similar useless hipster conveniences at those locations.
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Post by thereth on Apr 13, 2017 18:48:03 GMT 10
This is exactly what me amd mrs reth did. We moved from Perth to a small rural town, i moved the business out here and we have ended up buying 5 acres about 30km from town.
It has easily been the best decision of my life? and while the business has faltered due to me not taking population density into account enough, I managed to find a reasonable job and am happier here on a 'normal' wage as opposed to being on 100k+ in the city.
As alreafy mentioned the house prices can eadily make up for the difference in jncome anyway, our place was 210k with a 4x2 and our rates are only 550 a year. A sinilar place within 100km of Perth would run probably around the 650-700k mark last time i checked, and while the land isnt as fertile as down south and it gets damn hot, the place and people are fantastic.
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paranoia
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Post by paranoia on Apr 13, 2017 23:53:53 GMT 10
i know for a fact that many small towns don't bother advertising jobs cause they can post in a paper, internet or what ever and get no interest at all for months and even years. Better to door knock in these areas as you'll be surprised what is available to the right person. This is particularly the case with some "professional" jobs in a local council. when i've moved to remote locations my missus has picked up great jobs within two weeks, regularly. i was always surprised the number of vacant positions with gov, business, farming that can't be filled cause there is no max brenner or similar useless hipster conveniences at those locations. Even for trades & physical jobs, 'ask the locals' is the best way to go. You only have to ask a few, if you're keen and look fit word will get around fast. I think the key is being flexible.
I was at a local political forum a few nights ago where people were discussing directions for the nearby town, what they wanted to see in the area, what they thought we *needed*. A second petrol station, a shopping centre, expanded this and that... I'm still yet to understand the type of person who moves to the country then wants to turn it into the city... why the hell would you need/want a second servo?
I'll admit Beno, I had to google Max Brenner... but it sort of proves your point lol
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token
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Post by token on Apr 14, 2017 6:50:50 GMT 10
I was at a local political forum a few nights ago where people were discussing directions for the nearby town, what they wanted to see in the area, what they thought we *needed*. A second petrol station, a shopping centre, expanded this and that... I'm still yet to understand the type of person who moves to the country then wants to turn it into the city... why the hell would you need/want a second servo?
I'll admit Beno, I had to google Max Brenner... but it sort of proves your point lol
Agreed, I dont want my area to grow too much. I like it quiet, but i am aware that there are is a bit of land about so if its anyone id prefer preppers.
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Post by graynomad on Apr 14, 2017 7:10:29 GMT 10
There are a few blocks for sale near me, been on the market for ages because this is hardly a go-ahead area, just the way I like it OTOH it's close enough to Bundaberg to shop there every few weeks, and we always seem to miss the really bad weather, no fires, floods or cyclones, close but never right here (so far). But AFAIK the cheapest is still $90k. We have 3 preppers in a row, so that's about 100 acres under our "control", a 4th or 5th would be good.
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token
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Post by token on Apr 14, 2017 7:47:40 GMT 10
There are a few blocks for sale near me, been on the market for ages because this is hardly a go-ahead area, just the way I like it OTOH it's close enough to Bundaberg to shop there every few weeks, and we always seem to miss the really bad weather, no fires, floods or cyclones, close but never right here (so far). But AFAIK the cheapest is still $90k. We have 3 preppers in a row, so that's about 100 acres under our "control", a 4th or 5th would be good. For sure, better to know who it is neighboring you and their basic values and understandings than someone you don't. If they are stable, private people with a life, not interested in bothering you, going about their own business but friendly and relaxed it would be a good thing.
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Post by Joey on Apr 14, 2017 18:13:48 GMT 10
I would love to be able to buy at least 10acres and live there with the place setup for self producing food wise to reduce the weekly shopping bill. But unfortunately the misso doesn't see it that way. She wants to be close to the big shopping centres etc. She has settled in nicely to the small town we live in now, but it's a 190km trip to the nearest major centre with the big shops. But we have what we need to survive here, coles, several servos, hardware, country target, community clubs etc. We probably only make the trip to the big smoke maybe once a month if that for a treat, or I need to get something from supercheap/Bunnings.
But as I said I would like to actually buy something then rent, but the misso doesn't want big land, "because some crazy guy will come out of the bush and attack us" lol But for the meantime, I'm happy to sit back and work on getting myself financially stable to be in a better position to buy a house within the next 5years.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2017 9:50:38 GMT 10
This may sound like a silly question but what does anyone know about living on a mining lease. From what I understand and I must say that is very little, you can find some land preferably not private stake a claim dig a shaft and put up construction on it all on a miners lease. I don;t even know if it is still legal, but I do know a significant number of houses in the Ballarat region were on miners leases....which might a solution to high property prices etc. It may also be a good way to set up a bug out location at a reasonable cost if it works as I outlined.
Aside from that I was on the land with the nearest neighbor about four kilometers away, and I now live in a city with little more than a meter between houses. And yes I do miss the country badly, but the practicality is that as you get older you must consider the services your going to need in your old age, and to wait until your incapable to transition only means a lot of your efforts will go down the drain. Food for thought!
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Post by Joey on Apr 16, 2017 11:36:18 GMT 10
A mining lease is a lot of red tape to get through to get it initially started. An exploration lease on the other hand is a quicker process and easier. But unless you start digging said tunnel and have big dirty machinery around, it won't it won't effect prices.
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Apr 16, 2017 15:55:14 GMT 10
This may sound like a silly question but what does anyone know about living on a mining lease. From what I understand and I must say that is very little, you can find some land preferably not private stake a claim dig a shaft and put up construction on it all on a miners lease. I don;t even know if it is still legal, but I do know a significant number of houses in the Ballarat region were on miners leases....which might a solution to high property prices etc. It may also be a good way to set up a bug out location at a reasonable cost if it works as I outlined. Aside from that I was on the land with the nearest neighbor about four kilometers away, and I now live in a city with little more than a meter between houses. And yes I do miss the country badly, but the practicality is that as you get older you must consider the services your going to need in your old age, and to wait until your incapable to transition only means a lot of your efforts will go down the drain. Food for thought! I do a lot of work with mining leases and property rights. Mining leases are usually granted on a property that has proven mineral resources, and the proponent generally has to have intention to mine the minerals. There are some old mining leases where historic mining occurred and has since been abandoned but the lease remains in force. The gov. would still require annual lease payment +$35,000 per annum and annual reporting as well as a rehabilitation bond. Ownership of the surface rights and land can still be privately held but an agreement needs to be in place between the land holder and the owner of the mining lease. Some case where there is long wall underground coal mining where the surface of the property is not being disturbed a mineral lease can be held on the property with no effect on the land owner till one gets ground subsidence and groundwater issues, then it becomes a legal issue. It is also possible like in the Hunter valley were two different companies own the mineral leases on the same property - ie coal seams of different depths the one company mining under the other one. It can also get wired were two companies has rights to different commodities on the same property ie. gold and silver and the other company uranium. Exploration licenses can be taken out over any property to my knowledge without consent of landowner, in NSW a minimum bond of $10,000 is needed plus the registration fees, but any work that is to be undertaken on the property required landholder agreement and community consultation ie. advertisement in the press as well as an environmental impact statement. There is also a minimum requirement of annual expenditure on the exploration lease and reporting of results to keep the lease else it if forfeited. If the land owner does not want to let exploration take place on their land it can end in court and the owner forced to allow the exploration, compensation is given for usage etc.... The mining lease I work with has lots of private and gov land owners, the active mining areas are only located on a few property on a very massive lease. One can go online and research any property to see if there is an exploration or mining lease covering the property - one woman I work with did a check on her 70,000 acre property and found that recently some company has taken out a lease that covers part of her property.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2017 18:16:03 GMT 10
Thank you for that, it has got me wondering how a friend of mine has a deer hunters hut in a state forest and says he can because he has a mining lease....part of that was he had to have a big hole next to the building so it could be called a mine and that was part of the deal. But I have not seen that mate for a few years now and have no idea if his hut still exists of the lease is still going. I could not imagine him putting out very much money on his lease each year as he was pretty thrifty. Was he feeding me a load of cobblers do you think?
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