qlder
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Post by qlder on Jul 8, 2018 17:59:12 GMT 10
Just wondering if anyone was planning on bugging out to a desert location? Tried to justify it myself but simply can't. Just a harsh environment where even today people perish. Anyone got any thoughts otherwise?
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Beno
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Post by Beno on Jul 8, 2018 18:38:43 GMT 10
I’ll be bugging out and away from the desert myself. However there is more meat out here than you can poke your skewer at. I can spot goats and roos from kilometres away. If i was to stay out here it’d be along the Darling or major river. In shtf the water flow would be better than what it is now and more viable to live along one. One of the other pluses is that there will be few people out here to fight off.
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Jul 8, 2018 21:14:29 GMT 10
I have looked at a number of abandoned mining villages in desert locations - there are some very high up on my option list. Here is a good story of two German geologist that escaped (Namibia) during WW2 and hid in the desert, well a southern African desert in the early 1940" has a lot to offer. A good read... "The sheltering Desert". archive.org/stream/shelteringdesert007109mbp#page/n0/mode/2up
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Post by spinifex on Jul 9, 2018 18:04:42 GMT 10
I read that book on Spatials recommendation. It's really good. But missing current applicibility in terms of how desert infrastructure has changed since 1940's.
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Post by spinifex on Jul 9, 2018 18:12:28 GMT 10
My plans A through D involve staying put. My plan E is go back into the desert from whence I came ... precisely because it's extremely repellent to 'intruders'.
Naturally an important part of that is having possession of ground truthed water maps and experience with production horticulture in the desert environment.
Best thing: plenty of meat out there.
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qlder
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Post by qlder on Jul 9, 2018 19:11:30 GMT 10
Yep mate I agree. Plenty of meat, but f**k all water. And unless you are willing to keep a bore going, the water is pretty inconsistent. If you are at a decent waterhole, well thats where you are stuck until it eventually rains.
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qlder
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Post by qlder on Jul 9, 2018 19:44:33 GMT 10
Indeed. Was meant to walk cattle from one bore to another at one time. Only about 8ks. Should have been easy. Looked at the map, sanhills the whole way. Mongrel tight sandhills, not the ones with space in between. Picked an alternate route and it took 4 days with portable yards. But never would have made it otherwise. Even a man walking, I doubt you would get half way even at night. Very unforgiving.
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Post by thereth on Jul 10, 2018 15:25:04 GMT 10
depends on how 'desert' you mean, I am on the edge of the wheatbelt so while not complete desert, it would incredibly inhospitable for a lot of people, especially for 'city people' who have no concept of water requirements, salts, 4wding etc
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Jul 10, 2018 16:01:58 GMT 10
depends on how 'desert' you mean, I am on the edge of the wheatbelt so while not complete desert, it would incredibly inhospitable for a lot of people, especially for 'city people' who have no concept of water requirements, salts, 4wding etc True desert is defined as having a mean annual rainfall of less than 250mm. I used to work outback NSW at ±400mm mean annual rainfall that was bad enough. The last two years the area has been in drought in 2017 only had like less than 200mm and 2018 year to date only 23.5mm, many farm dams have dried up. Climate fluctuation and also flooding risk in deserts need to be accounted for.
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Post by thereth on Jul 10, 2018 16:12:43 GMT 10
we are bloody close, average rainfall is 324mm at the closest town, which is 35km west of me (closer to the coast). :-)
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Jul 10, 2018 16:25:19 GMT 10
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Jul 10, 2018 16:46:53 GMT 10
we are bloody close, average rainfall is 324mm at the closest town, which is 35km west of me (closer to the coast). :-) Yeah with the high temps that Australia has - one could classify areas with rainfall less than 350mm as being desert.
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Post by thereth on Jul 10, 2018 16:51:05 GMT 10
you could, it certainly isnt on par with the 'proper' desert, but it can certainly kill someone very easily if there was no easy access to facilities
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feralemma
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Post by feralemma on Jul 10, 2018 18:12:39 GMT 10
If anyone plans on bugging out to the desert a few trips out there beforehand to find things would be a good idea. I've been to abandoned aboriginal communities in the desert that are still fully equipped with bores and houses etc, apparently they were too far from town. But knowing where to find them is essential if that's your plan.
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Post by spinifex on Jul 10, 2018 19:15:37 GMT 10
Yep mate I agree. Plenty of meat, but f**k all water. And unless you are willing to keep a bore going, the water is pretty inconsistent. If you are at a decent waterhole, well thats where you are stuck until it eventually rains. Just a lot of dry country between the water. There are a good number of very ample sources in the western SA and NT deserts where I previously worked. Also plenty of infrastructure to access the huge and excellent water resources below the surface in certain areas. Must admit I'd never attempt to re-locate to an unfamiliar desert area. That would be begging for trouble. I look at it this way: I'm only ever shifting out of home under one circumstance - being driven out by a hostile power infinitely greater than me. Pretty much the scenario faced by our Aboriginal people. And one of the places they managed to persist the longest without being too badly molested was the central deserts. The last Pintubi only called it quits in 1973. They persisted the hard way with a complete lack of technology and no ability to pre-prepare with modern materials. I figure if we make it to any one of the very good water sources I know about no one will bother us. The biggest arse-pain to content with will be the flies. But at least the need for 'security' is much reduced.
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grumble
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Post by grumble on Jul 10, 2018 19:34:59 GMT 10
Having spent a fair bit of time working and bumming around between Cloncurry , Gregory downs and the gulf savannah region I will say this
Anyone planning on heading into the rough country had better have some real good maps and a compass because its not just a lack of water that will kill you or the heat its the difficulty at times of navigating your direction of travel you could easily miss a dam or a water hole by hundreds of meters due to the lay of the terrain especially the downs country with its cracked open black soil plains with no real features for as far as the eye can see or the gently rolling hill and plains in the savannah where one can easily miss something as there is a lack of vantage points
Its funny how the savannah country has plenty of water and food that's reasonably easy to find compared to a desert but the topography of the land makes it that you can miss things very easily and the amount of energy that one would expend checking out possible locations for water would probably sap you to the point you become to weak to keep going
the one thing I remember with the savannah country is the rivers are upside down so a dry dusty river could have more water than you could ever need just a 1m below your feet but if you didn't know what to look for it was just another dry sandy river
Mind you I have many a fond memory of camping along the ethridge river enjoying one of its many hidden water holes that never dried up
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Post by graynomad on Jul 10, 2018 20:52:07 GMT 10
... the one thing I remember with the savannah country is the rivers are upside down so a dry dusty river could have more water than you could ever need just a 1m below your feet but if you didn't know what to look for it was just another dry sandy river ... I was camped in Cape Range NP (Ningaloo) a few years ago, there is NO water anywhere, but plenty of kangaroos. So I got to wondering how they drank. I searched for a sandy hollow and dug down, within maybe 6" I struck water, another 6 and I had a nice little pool. I then watched the animals and did see them digging on occasion.
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Post by spinifex on Jul 10, 2018 21:07:50 GMT 10
and also flooding risk in deserts need to be accounted for. Heh, heh, heh ... yeah ... biggest floods I've ever seen were in spinifex 'desert' country west of Alice. 250mm dumped in 24 hours. You wouldn't think flat sand dune country could run so much surface water! Drove 200km for 6 hours in the southern part of the Tanami road thru water that rarely went below the hubs, was frequently to the top of the wheels and in several stretches lapping over the bonnet of our 75 series cruiser. We went back up that road about 6 weeks later and there were erosion channels either side of the track that were 1.5 to 2 metres deep - wide enough to easily drive a car along the bottom. If we'd strayed too far either side during our drive the car would have ended up in one and become a submarine. Biggest hailstorms out there in summer too. On one occasion we came across a big drift of hail knee deep a few metres wide and about 40 metres long. On a 35 degree day. Very weird.
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Post by Peter on Jul 10, 2018 22:09:34 GMT 10
Yep. I was once in Esperance (WA south coast, just at the western end of the Bight) and watched a spectacular lighting storm come through from the north, including hail. This was late December/early January, and it was hot weather.
Maybe I don't have the experience, but I'm damned if I can figure out weather in the outback.
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grumble
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Post by grumble on Jul 11, 2018 16:35:01 GMT 10
... the one thing I remember with the savannah country is the rivers are upside down so a dry dusty river could have more water than you could ever need just a 1m below your feet but if you didn't know what to look for it was just another dry sandy river ... I was camped in Cape Range NP (Ningaloo) a few years ago, there is NO water anywhere, but plenty of kangaroos. So I got to wondering how they drank. I searched for a sandy hollow and dug down, within maybe 6" I struck water, another 6 and I had a nice little pool. I then watched the animals and did see them digging on occasion. animals and insects can and will lead you to water if you have the patience and are not to weak to follow them
Bees are a good indicator of moisture and potentially water not far from the surface in sandy creeks
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