tails
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Post by tails on May 19, 2016 19:32:25 GMT 10
Question Team.
I am liking this idea regarding building your storm shelter etc into the side of a hill.
I can see it working, (being covered in earth etc to provide thermal protection against forest fires) however am left wondering...
With the fire raging all round you, wouldn't it burn up all the oxygen, ie you will be safe from the flames etc, however would you end up suffocating instead...
Currently looking at a property in a heavily forested area, although it doesn't have a hill as such to dig into, there is a reasonable slope where you could dig into and down a bit and then use the spoil to achieve the same aim...
Are there any experts on here who could enlighten me.
Am thinking maybe getting a couple of spare dive tanks to overcome this however further questions arise...
ie how long would the fire burn for, then what sort of timeframe would we be looking at before the smoke clears and you could breath again... (am mindful of the big fires in Canada.)equaling X number of tanks per person..
all generally speaking of course as each fire would be different...
but at least this would give me a reason to stay or bugger off till its over....
thoughts
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gasman
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Post by gasman on May 19, 2016 19:48:05 GMT 10
Question Team. I am liking this idea regarding building your storm shelter etc into the side of a hill. I can see it working, (being covered in earth etc to provide thermal protection against forest fires) however am left wondering... With the fire raging all round you, wouldn't it burn up all the oxygen, ie you will be safe from the flames etc, however would you end up suffocating instead... Currently looking at a property in a heavily forested area, although it doesn't have a hill as such to dig into, there is a reasonable slope where you could dig into and down a bit and then use the spoil to achieve the same aim... Are there any experts on here who could enlighten me. Am thinking maybe getting a couple of spare dive tanks to overcome this however further questions arise... ie how long would the fire burn for, then what sort of timeframe would we be looking at before the smoke clears and you could breath again... (am mindful of the big fires in Canada.)equaling X number of tanks per person.. all generally speaking of course as each fire would be different... but at least this would give me a reason to stay or bugger off till its over.... thoughts we have a fire bunker built into a hill with air( scuba) tanks And some carbon dioxide absorbers The question of how long you could last in it is very difficult and many variables E.g how many people , how big the shelter and the people, claustrophobia etc It would be very uncomfortable stuffy claustrophobic hot and the side effects of high carbon dioxide, but if the alterative is death by fire I think I would cope It is important to have well sealing fireproof and smoke proof doors and the positive pressure an air cylinder provides helps stop smoke entering Also need a means of viewing outside so u don't have to open the door to see if it's safe to go out |
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Post by graynomad on May 19, 2016 21:24:47 GMT 10
Yep. Scuba tanks would be my first thought but I haven't researched this much.
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gasman
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Post by gasman on May 20, 2016 7:30:31 GMT 10
This is one reason why I want a fire shelter, my retreat about 3 years ago. Grass burns as well as forest it seems. The fire shelter would go into the rise just behind and to the right of the cabin. Those trees are slowly being thinned out.
Looks like your building got close! One of our issues in vic is fireproof buildings ( as well as a bunker) Was only talking about this with a fellow prepper yesterday Steel , concrete and fireproof insulation is the way I think I will go |
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shinester
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Post by shinester on May 20, 2016 10:05:25 GMT 10
So, it's 'mostly' radiant heat that kills in bushfires. This makes sense otherwise the fire would put itself out if there wasn't enough oxygen to maintain combustion, much like what happens when you dump CO2 or a fire-blanket on a fire. Anecdotally, recently during the burn off period there were people with large bonfires perhaps 75m from the road and you could partially feel the heat 'in' the car as you drove past. Fairly telling.
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Post by Joey on May 20, 2016 10:24:57 GMT 10
With all properties in rural/bushfire areas, you need to prepare the surrounding area of structures. No trees near, managed grassed area around the buildings, and or replace the grass with pebbles or concrete for the 20m around d the house. Install 50mm male camlock fittings on water tanks so firies can hook up to them to defend. Install valves on your down pipes and put a hose fitting above 1 so you can fill he gutters with water. If you have gas cylinders hooked up to the house, build a shield wall for them with fire resistant bricks and maybe install a water spray bar to wet them down when a fires coming.
These are a few ideas that can help defend a place a fire, but most importantly get in contact with your local fire warden. Invite them out to assess your bush fire risks and what you have in place and they will advise any further things you can do to help.
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grumble
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Post by grumble on May 20, 2016 14:38:49 GMT 10
Personally I think they can make a suitable relocatable short term dwelling if fitted out right
My brother used one for quite some time it was mounted on a trailer that he towed behind his grader
Ehen he wanted to set up a new base camp he just parked up the trailer and set out a few things and he was done in about 15 minutes
Best thing was his trailer had water storage and fuel storage and its own diesel generator with a hot water coil on the exhaust system so even though he was out in the middle of nowhere he still had hot water for showers and washing
Everything inside the container was based around a ships galley so maximum usage of space but it still had a shower toilet kitchen and bedroom/lounge room
I have also seen them used as a cyclone shelter
The way it was set out as pretty basic it was mounted on top of a concrete slab then besser block walls built around it with space to place a water tank on a stand on one side between the container and the besser blocks then lose loam carefully placed against the walls making nice sloped earth banks on three sides of it a simple roof of that clear plastic roofing iron stuff was then used to give it weather protection
Inside the container it was pretty basic the walls had been painted white and sealed the floor redone in ply and sealed a whirly bird extractor fan with tubing to give some ventilation
Down at the rear near the ventilation there was the a sleeping area with 6 bunk beds that were mounted to the wall and could fold up to make more space then at the front there was a small comms section with a desk and storage facilities for food water and medical supplies
When set up like this I think they are very usefull but to build a house from I think I would pass and have nice brick or block home
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gasman
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Post by gasman on May 20, 2016 14:53:31 GMT 10
Welcome grumble
You're on that other site as well?
So are a lot of us!!!
Much nicer here
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grumble
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Post by grumble on May 20, 2016 18:18:08 GMT 10
Welcome grumble You're on that other site as well? So are a lot of us!!! Much nicer here Thank you GM I am but not very much there isn't very much on there that interests me these days
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Hoopy
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Post by Hoopy on Jun 2, 2016 22:46:10 GMT 10
If I bought a few to make an abode from I'd go D.I.Y on a small sandblaster ($120 on evilbay)recond it might cost $500 to blast 3 or 4 by the time you buy the sand...where ya blast 'em is up to you,bye bye to the evil lead and poisonous residues the wooden floors could be ripped out and replaced cheaply.Maybe rip the floor out and bed them into a fresh slab as an alternative.They are not hard to insulate or water proof against rust so berming them with soil would give thermal mass...easy to heat and cool in summer.
Krulls simple farm shed roof structure would be the ducks nuts for the basic project,if you wanted 2 stories and keep a low profile excavate for the depth of 1 and set the 2nd out normal house/shed height.
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Hoopy
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Post by Hoopy on Jun 2, 2016 22:49:43 GMT 10
That one was built up in QLD by some researchers. |
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tomatoes
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Post by tomatoes on Dec 11, 2016 15:17:10 GMT 10
Resurrecting an old thread - Has anyone looked at these shipping container homes? www.containerbuildgroup.com.au/4-5-bedroom/They look spacious and it seems they can be made quickly and cheaply compared with having a house built more conventionally. |
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Post by SA Hunter on Dec 29, 2016 19:16:14 GMT 10
Wow, love that site!!!!!
Thanks for posting!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2017 20:16:04 GMT 10
I lived in a 20ft insulated shipping container that I had as a construction site store room, after my divorce. If I could live without all my clutter I like to have around me, I would still be there...... I recommend adding some vents, split system AC or pot belly stove. They could certainly be good cyclone proof housing if anchored down.
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paranoia
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Post by paranoia on Feb 20, 2017 22:49:33 GMT 10
Has been a dream of mine for about 5-6 years to build a house out of sea containers. The strength of the structure coupled with the modularity and general industrial look of it always keeps the imagination going.
For those interested in the topic I found great inspiration and discussion on the topic in the book, 'Container Atlas'.
www.amazon.com/Container-Atlas-Practical-Guide-Architecture/dp/3899552865/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1487594363&sr=8-1&keywords=container+atlas
It mostly details large scale industrial use such as apartments and research structures but there are some smaller residences also. Have had it for a few years and I go back to it every few months, great book.
Geek; Was this a refrig' container or one modified for site use? DIY or commercial?
All my designs so far have ended up having external cladding to maintain internal dimensions whilst achieving insulation properties but I'm always curious to hear peoples experience living in containers, especially in Australia (far harder to get examples in our climate). |
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Post by graynomad on Feb 21, 2017 7:39:35 GMT 10
...
All my designs so far have ended up having external cladding to maintain internal dimensions whilst achieving insulation properties but I'm always curious to hear peoples experience living in containers, especially in Australia (far harder to get examples in our climate). As everyone probably knows by now that's what we did (IE external cladding). Not much of the roof is covered at this point though. Over the last few weeks of very hot conditions we have been quite comfortable, the kitchen area gets pretty warm but technically that's not in a container as that's an extension. We also live in among the trees and get a lot of shade, neighbours comment on how much cooler it is at our place because they are more exposed, so our experience would not translate to a location out in the open. Another thing about being comfortable in the heat is ventilation, if you get breezes through it will be a lot more comfortable. I see a lot of designs with only small windows and doors, or even large ones with no opposing opening, there's no point having one large sliding door to let air in if there's nowhere for the air to go. |
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bear508
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Post by bear508 on Feb 21, 2017 19:38:34 GMT 10
I am looking to build out of containers. Single story, very simple, open plan design with large windows and doors. One idea I had was to run sheets of reinforcing mesh vertically about 200mm away from the container walls and use it to grow vine type plants on it. Something that once it is established will shade the walls in the summer and allow the sun through to the walls in winter.
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Post by SA Hunter on Feb 21, 2017 21:48:32 GMT 10
A Fishing/Diving tour place in Port Lincoln built their new shop front out of about 6-8 shipping containers. It actually looks really good from the outside.
I might drop in one day and see if I can get a copy of their plans.
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paranoia
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Post by paranoia on Feb 21, 2017 22:42:12 GMT 10
grey; Did you clad directly onto the container or build a frame to clad onto giving you an air gap?
Yeah best bet is to avoid the sunlight to begin with, I'm thinking semi-underground but there are always engineering challenges that go along with that.
bear; I love the open plan designs using containers as the permitter with huge open spaces in the middle. I just cant help stacking them though as I really want that 5m high roof in the middle. Would really take 'open plan' to the next level, I've seen a few nice designs using this concept.
The vine will definitely work for insulation but I worry about green walls close to the containers with humidity and rust. I suppose it all depends on climate and species selection.
Jay; Sounds great! I'd appreciate even just a photo next time you're there 
Here's a quick sketch I did up in paint demonstrating the 'semi-underground' concept I have in mind or something similar. Closed on 2/3 sides with retained earth. Could do 2 story without having the imposing structure and gain a lot of advantages in temperature regulation.
This is one house I always go back to. It's featured in the book I mentioned and follows most of what I aspire to. Large open plan, polished concrete, keeping the industrial nature of the containers... perfect. |
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bear508
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Post by bear508 on Feb 22, 2017 0:05:10 GMT 10
Hey Paranoia,
The 2 storey, high roof would be cool, but I have had a double knee replacement not too long ago. So I want to avoid stairs as much as possible. Having said that, I would like to stand one container up on it's end to use as a raised platform for my telescope!! it definitely won't be something I will be going up every day. I hope to build in the SW of WA, so am hoping there too many climate type issues, might have to move the mesh further from the walls. It's all a learning curve!!
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