d
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Post by d on Jun 26, 2022 6:54:02 GMT 10
Full disclosure- this post is kinda a stream of nonsense dump so proceed with that in mind. To distract myself from my spreadsheet induced insomnia I got thinking about this perpetual discussion about generational wealth, the middle class squeeze and all the talk of about how our parents could do it on one income while the 5 kids went to private school, mum stayed home and dad made cans at the factory.
I find this discussion is challenging as there are so many factors not often widely discussed as often people seem to expect their current life but with the level of effort from days gone by. For example a one income household with kids, a car and a freestanding house close to work but with the modern conveniences of eating out very regularly, international or very regular holidays, credit cards, technology like tablets, phones and required subscriptions, regular new cars, the boat en so on however this wasn’t the life our parents had..
However, culture has changed around work as well, it seems the days of working a job for 40 years retiring and the company looking after you are gone and in an effort to outpace inflation and stagnating wages a worker job hops to get the salary growth required to maintain the new costs of living further reducing the stability of work is the changing nature and conditions of work.
Overall there seems no ability for an apples to apples comparison but the push toward “having what our parents had” persists, generally I think prepping starts to bridge a bit of this divide in that it pushes individuals to consider what’s actually important, what’s actually needed and of cause some level of self reliance however there are exceptions when it comes to stockpiling the 16th backpack and the spare cars for bugging out to the coast house but for the “average” person building some resilience, it ain’t bad.
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Jun 26, 2022 7:59:09 GMT 10
Full disclosure- this post is kinda a stream of nonsense dump so proceed with that in mind. To distract myself from my spreadsheet induced insomnia I got thinking about this perpetual discussion about generational wealth, the middle class squeeze and all the talk of about how our parents could do it on one income while the 5 kids went to private school, mum stayed home and dad made cans at the factory. I find this discussion is challenging as there are so many factors not often widely discussed as often people seem to expect their current life but with the level of effort from days gone by. For example a one income household with kids, a car and a freestanding house close to work but with the modern conveniences of eating out very regularly, international or very regular holidays, credit cards, technology like tablets, phones and required subscriptions, regular new cars, the boat en so on however this wasn’t the life our parents had.. However, culture has changed around work as well, it seems the days of working a job for 40 years retiring and the company looking after you are gone and in an effort to outpace inflation and stagnating wages a worker job hops to get the salary growth required to maintain the new costs of living further reducing the stability of work is the changing nature and conditions of work. Overall there seems no ability for an apples to apples comparison but the push toward “having what our parents had” persists, generally I think prepping starts to bridge a bit of this divide in that it pushes individuals to consider what’s actually important, what’s actually needed and of cause some level of self reliance however there are exceptions when it comes to stockpiling the 16th backpack and the spare cars for bugging out to the coast house but for the “average” person building some resilience, it ain’t bad. The good old days were better less stress. Today mental health is a national pandemic. Yes we have intranet TV phones smart devices. They make us much more productive and we work harder with longer hours. In the past a large opencut mine would have a team of like 6 surveyors and 5 drafting people to make maps and do designs etc, Now it is down to one or two surveyors with drones and fancy PC software. Spoke to group engineer last week he said that when he started in the sugar industry it was an entire hallway of chief, two assistant chief, and engineering mangers for each section of the mill.. Today we pay over 50% tax if you consider income tax, GST, stamp duty, property tax, fishing licence, additional excise tax on fuel and alcohol etc.,, One goes to work for 6 month of the year just to pay the gov and only work for yourself for 6 months. When the economy fails and the big reset starts it will be a good thing, can keep my labour for myself. Every town will have their own butch as an example, better community less drugs on the street. safety will evenly come back. Now it is security cameras, to dangerous for kits to walk to school. Life is hell one does not realise how bad we have got. One has to step out of the situation we are in and then look back and realise what hell we are living in.
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norseman
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Post by norseman on Jun 26, 2022 8:22:10 GMT 10
There was much better Freedom of Speech, less interference from Politicians, Government and other assorted bottom feeders. Very affordable Housing, Food, Fuel and Energy. Morale in general was much higher not the depression and Mental issues we see today. There was also less multiculty and a stronger more genous and cohesive population. In the "Good Old Days" each Generation promised to deliver their kids a "better" life than the one they had themselves, in no way is that now guaranteed! You could mostly trust and respect the Police even though many were seriously corrupt, now you must film everything! Should I keep going..............?
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Post by milspec on Jun 26, 2022 8:36:19 GMT 10
I am responding with the bias of my own circumstance here. I did work the one job for 33 years and my partner also has circumstances enabling a mid 50's retirement.
So we left the city to go rural and as preppers that demands off grid in my book. It seems to me that the cost of a rural acreage serving as an excellent BOL compares very beneficially against a city dwelling. Even if one allows for the non trivial expenses for vehicles & machinery etc that go hand in hand with rural living.
I kinda feel unplugged from the rat race and because I consider privacy to be really important I feel somewhat unplugged grom the matrix (still connected by a few wires though of course). This aspect in particular demands a different mindset from most people because it means sacrifing the convenience of smart devices and 'handy' apps. I feel this takes me back to a more traditional way of doing things. Rural living with a self sufficiency perspective also makes one reallocate time and interests to realise that self sufficiency goal.
Hence quality of life here feels good and my day to day activities feel rewarding as they are improving my lot.
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norseman
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Post by norseman on Jun 26, 2022 8:56:36 GMT 10
We were lucky, got to live in a Rural Environment our kid's Mum didn't need to work so she got to do heaps with them as a one income family. Eating out is usually a serious disappointment lots of money for classic Aussie mediocrity, I'd rather spend that $80 on a maxed out arvo BBQ. Overseas Travel who needs it, yes maybe if it's an escape from a mundane existence. "Credit cards, technology like tablets, phones and required subscriptions, regular new cars", for preppers these things if needed at all are tools not markers of wealth, success or social status.
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dadbod
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Post by dadbod on Jun 26, 2022 10:37:18 GMT 10
yeah, we look back with rose coloured glasses, but by most measures we are better off today.
You cant live off a single middle class income in today's society. the corporate push for women to leave raising their kids and provide labour to the system did nothing for liberating them and enhancing womens rights.
we live in a competitive society and you will struggle to compete with half the income of others.
I think of it as we are living in our kids future nostalgia. we are in a good old days, just not our own.
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bug
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Post by bug on Jun 26, 2022 11:33:48 GMT 10
Yes they did. A parent has one key job in life and that is to make sure their children have a better life than they did. This was possible up until about the 2000s. Now the concentration of wealth within a tiny, tiny minority and offshoring of jobs has gotten so bad that for most people this is no longer possible.
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bug
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Post by bug on Jun 26, 2022 11:36:18 GMT 10
That said, if you start going back any further than about the 1950s, life definitely gets much harder than today. There are plenty of idiots who wish they were 'kingz', but anyone who thinks that say 16th century royalty had it better than even someone in a rented apartment today, is a total moron.
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norseman
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Post by norseman on Jun 26, 2022 11:50:52 GMT 10
As a "kid" in the 60's I lived in single parent poverty and working class slums. As a "youth" in the 70's and 80's that was an awesome time! Life started getting a bit more serious again in the 90's! And now....I continue to work on my E&E Plan!
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Tim Horton
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Post by Tim Horton on Jun 26, 2022 13:22:39 GMT 10
Did the good old days ever exist ??
Yes they did.... That was the time when I had the strength and stamina to do the things I needed to do, the things I wanted to do, and enough left over to enjoy it all...
Today I still enjoy much... Just don't do as much as I used to...
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Jun 26, 2022 13:34:53 GMT 10
yeah, we look back with rose coloured glasses, but by most measures we are better off today. You cant live off a single middle class income in today's society. the corporate push for women to leave raising their kids and provide labour to the system did nothing for liberating them and enhancing womens rights. we live in a competitive society and you will struggle to compete with half the income of others. I think of it as we are living in our kids future nostalgia. we are in a good old days, just not our own. Look at fertility rates down most western and Asian countries. People not getting married, getting married much later then struggling to have children. The world has an aging population with worker shortages. It is not because life is good and people have faith in the future the opposite is true.
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d
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Post by d on Jun 26, 2022 14:07:17 GMT 10
yeah, we look back with rose coloured glasses, but by most measures we are better off today. You cant live off a single middle class income in today's society. the corporate push for women to leave raising their kids and provide labour to the system did nothing for liberating them and enhancing womens rights. we live in a competitive society and you will struggle to compete with half the income of others. I think of it as we are living in our kids future nostalgia. we are in a good old days, just not our own. Look at fertility rates down most western and Asian countries. People not getting married, getting married much later then struggling to have children. The world has an aging population with worker shortages. It is not because life is good and people have faith in the future the opposite is true. That’s assuming that it’s cost of living pressures are the reason people aren’t getting married/having kids which is a large assumption
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d
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Post by d on Jun 26, 2022 14:11:18 GMT 10
That said, if you start going back any further than about the 1950s, life definitely gets much harder than today. There are plenty of idiots who wish they were 'kingz', but anyone who thinks that say 16th century royalty had it better than even someone in a rented apartment today, is a total moron. Tbh it kinda seems we actually had a half century abnormality where all the stars aligned (disregarding world wars, 15%+ interest rates etc etc) and this era of prosperity is now seen as a baseline. In the scope of history however that was the exception not the norm.
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bug
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Post by bug on Jun 26, 2022 14:28:38 GMT 10
Yeah, we've had 70 years of no major conflict, growing freedom and it occurred at a time of technological revolution. It would be difficult to find another period in history like that. We're probably settling back into the old norm of authoritarianism with on and off conflicts and a largely powerless lower and middle class. That doesn't necessarily mean disaster or poverty. It does mean that the days of easy rides are over.
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norseman
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Post by norseman on Jun 26, 2022 14:30:45 GMT 10
That said, if you start going back any further than about the 1950s, life definitely gets much harder than today. There are plenty of idiots who wish they were 'kingz', but anyone who thinks that say 16th century royalty had it better than even someone in a rented apartment today, is a total moron. Tbh it kinda seems we actually had a half century abnormality where all the stars aligned (disregarding world wars, 15%+ interest rates etc etc) and this era of prosperity is now seen as a baseline. In the scope of history however that was the exception not the norm. It was an effing anomaly which some of us were lucky enough to live the prime of our lives through! Now it's over and it ain't coming back ever! Three meals a day "normal" is soff**** talk!
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Beno
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Post by Beno on Jun 26, 2022 14:36:25 GMT 10
Look at fertility rates down most western and Asian countries. People not getting married, getting married much later then struggling to have children. The world has an aging population with worker shortages. It is not because life is good and people have faith in the future the opposite is true. That’s assuming that it’s cost of living pressures are the reason people aren’t getting married/having kids which is a large assumption As someone who is fecund and actively so🤟 i can assure you it is not a large assumption. Kids are now more planned than a trip to the moon and the result is much lower birthrates.
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tactile
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Post by tactile on Jun 26, 2022 14:48:08 GMT 10
Every day is an improvement from my perspective...there is nothing from my past that I miss and there is only looking forward. Bring it on.
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d
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Post by d on Jun 26, 2022 15:06:07 GMT 10
That’s assuming that it’s cost of living pressures are the reason people aren’t getting married/having kids which is a large assumption As someone who is fecund and actively so🤟 i can assure you it is not a large assumption. Kids are now more planned than a trip to the moon and the result is much lower birthrates. the Economic factor is one but not the only factor, reduced participation in organised religion, improved access and social acceptability of family planning and higher female participation in work at a high level all impact.
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frostbite
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Post by frostbite on Jun 26, 2022 15:46:35 GMT 10
In decades past we didn't live in a police state where cameras monitored almost our every movement, where government mandated injections of trial drugs to participate in society, where travel was severely curtailed, where your home or your personal data could be searched without a warrant, where cops dressed like special forces and were encouraged by their senior leaders to brurally bash unarmed civilians.....
Need I go on?
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Beno
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Post by Beno on Jun 26, 2022 15:56:21 GMT 10
Female participation in work was economic reform disguised as woman's rights so is 100% tied to economy, WW2 planted that seed in many companies heads. 75% plus the women in my cohort hate working and raising a family simultaneously but they now h….no option due to economics of house and living prices. Many actually say in semi seriousness they they dislike their kids but really this is a symptom of not being the superwoman that the feminist agenda promised they’d be. They were promised a land cruiser and given a lada.
religion is not an issue in my circle or anyone i know and social acceptability (based on environmental concerns) is negligible. economic factors dominate.
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