token
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Post by token on Oct 23, 2016 7:32:38 GMT 10
There's plenty of ways to add the Oxygen one of them as described and it's not about getting the oxygen, rather it's about how much oxygen can dissolve in the water compared to the number of fish in hot water temperatures. You put a lot of fish in a small space for higher production and it's fine if you have your air pumps but when it's hot, the ability for the water to take on O2 is lower than the need for the number of fish you have. So fish die off until the number of fish matches the oxygen levels in it. A solution is to cool the water, which takes an enormous amount of energy or as some breeders do, you pump pure O2 directly into the water and being a higher concentration than the air [air is 1/3 oxygen] it boosts the water oxygen for a short time. Trout are rather susceptible to low oxygen unlike many other breeds, though they are the best fish for Vic otherwise and yet half the speed of growth of silver perch [which are great up north]. To me it's one of a number of issues with Aquaponics, and I want to stress that my research centers around what works here in Vic, which would be similar for states in the south, though may be different depending on availability of fish and temperature. Perhaps the biggest issue is the need for the fish-food which is made from fish and most fish need the oils in the fish and is not cheap and not sustainable. You can supplement it a 'little' depending on the breed, and depending on where you live, black solider fly [no good down south as they die out during winter] and insect traps, though again the need for oils is a problem I ran into. This may not be the case for Talapia, I am unsure. The useful fish are the quick growing breeds and the available ones are carnivores down south. Talapia [which might be available in WA btw] are herbivores [well technically omnivores] so they can even be fed on food scrap, though of course would need a variety in their diet. Again, I've not researched them fully as you can't get them legally here in Vic [noxious animal] though they self breed , quick to grow, eat almost anything, very tolerant of conditions. If they were available where you are, I would pay a good deal of attention on the ability to feed them, is it possible to do sustainably [look at food production versus food needs of the fish] and I would imagine that would be via a variety of means. I also found that an aquaponics system was particularly complicated in that it needed a variety of systems working well at the same time with fairly tight tolerances for decent production, the necessity of good amounts of power, to which I did a great deal of research trying to find solutions for. The sacrifice here of power for food production versus other usage. I did make some headway there with low lift pumps that used minimal power. I ended up passing on it for the problems that weren't really surmountable with my location and available fish and found the simple no-pump hydroponics to be superior in food production [it has it's own problems that I'm currently ironing out], almost as good as pumped hydroponics, very low input, the possibility of capturing most of the nutrients and recycling them back into the system as you can use any liquefied fertilizer. I'm not certain that it's suitable for root crops, though I have contemplated sand as a medium, though growing spuds etc is easy and I think it's probably not worth the effort and you might as well do them in the ground/raised bed/wicking etc. Chickens, to my mind look promising with a good protein compliment with egg production, people have kept them without feed and whilst I'm not particularly familiar with them, I would imagine that feeding them with trapped insects/black soilder fly/worms/food scraps and chicken friendly pasture would probably do the trick. I have only rudimentary knowledge here. Rabbits concern me due to disease, otherwise they are fantastic as a means of protein, and I very much refer to Token our resident expert on the topic. Good commenting mate, yes ive read and or seen much of that on the aquaponics. A friend of mine was right into it for a few seasons there. Fish got a disease and needed to flush the thing with huge amounts of salt, it didnt work and the fish died. Food does grow great though. She last experimented with yabbies but then had to move, again, slower to grow and youll need plenty of them for food. It does grow great veggies though and fast. I did the kratky method of hydro and worked good, although the NPK ration varies depending on what you want to grow and i wouldnt say it would work for everything you want to grow without significant tweeking and effort. As for rabbits, im no expert and always learning. Did you know last year i started harder breeding and a new strain of Calici killed everything id done except 2 bucks and 1 doe. I lost over 20 rabbits in 3 weeks. This strain of calici killed kittens which the last strain didnt and it wasnt supposed to be out, although the fools website showed they let it out, then they took that page down and denied it Another friends rabbitry i set up lost 7 cages, 40 rabbits, another 23 rabbits. People who vaccinated at $30 a pop for a pet and $6 a pop for commercial lost their rabbits to the new strain! I have through just one doe and two bucks increased my rabbitry once more, only through just 3 litters, however, being Spring, im just sitting here waiting for the screams from my backyard again and to find dead rabbits. Hopefully we have some that can resist varying strains, ill have to wait and see. btw, did you end up eating that wabbit yet?
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token
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Post by token on Oct 23, 2016 7:17:02 GMT 10
Careful, Emu's won against the Australian army. ahaha, what have i just watched! where do you come up with this stuff shiney lol
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 22:56:53 GMT 10
haha, yes and nope! Yes to patience, but they are good kids. We want another 2 if we can have them, but running outa time, so have to see. Nope to the one eyed demon lol. Got 2 of em. Thing is, we are fertile. Never planned it this way tbh, we just got busy with life and then she would look at me across a room and i would look at her and someone sneezed and bam! pregnant again. Id never go back though, ever! No regrets at all, except not having more!
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 22:35:07 GMT 10
Thanks Peter, had a log in a ways back but didnt really get over much. Good to be here and hopefully i can contribute well to the community with what little knowledge or experience i do have and help out.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 22:04:49 GMT 10
My finger is hovering over the Ban Button for anyone who wishes to provide a spoiler without adequate warning in the thread title. Please - for your own sake - don't test me on this. Really lol, yes agreed, no spoilers, i hate them....but you shouldve seen what happened in season 6 with the..just kidding!
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 21:57:19 GMT 10
I also looked at Aquaponics with fish, though in Vic I didn't find a suitable fish [trout are close but can die in the heat due to O2 issues] ... Seeing this thread has been bumped (which is a good thing), I wonder if agitation of the water's surface would provide adequate oxygen. Perhaps if a windmill could be geared to drive a watermill-style propeller type device to agitate the surface this would help the fish survive. Think of a steamboat's propeller; this would surely add air to the water. Dont forget, if you have a cool area that is enclosed such as a basement, then trout should do fine. As far as i understand it, it is only speculated (correct me if im wrong) that the heating of the water causes the loss of oxygen in the water, which is indeed a good thing if its absolutely true because decent enough aeration should fix the problem. Worst thing ever is to think the trout are doing good because they havent floated to the top like last year when it got hot and find out that its because they are dead at the bottom. Its annoying to me that the ultimate aquaponics fish Talapia are banned from being bred at home in many ways, but in others its understandable i suppose (sigh).
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 21:49:52 GMT 10
Waiting with anticipation. If you didnt know, its the release of the new season of the Walking Dead ***EDIT*** PLEASE BE WARNED THIS THREAD MAY HAVE SPOILERS SO READ NO FURTHER IF YOU DONT WANT TO KNOW PLEASE.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 21:45:02 GMT 10
Just got to check with state and local regulations about keeping rabbits. A lot of places they are banned as pets and classed as pest animals Vics ok atm, but yes, you might have to grow those 'guinea pigs' with big ears in one particular state i know of
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 21:38:02 GMT 10
From the moment I started reading your post (Token), I thought of how wonderfully this would add to compost. Great to see the local barter trade going on, too. Joey, I didn't even come close to thinking of it as a fire starter. Is it any good? Im a big believer in bartering Pete, it has its limitations in our current system understandably though, but id love to see it work more out our way. If we can live as free from this system now, hopefully not much will change in many specific societal breakdown scenarios.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 21:35:12 GMT 10
And keep a glad bag of the stuff in the gear bags as fire starter It works good as tinder thats for sure, plus, no fire, then we cant fry the eggs and cook the chicken lol
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 21:32:54 GMT 10
If your raising chooks for meat which arent the commercial bird (Cobb500 or Ross700) that we buy everywhere today cooked or raw for cooking, you would know that your birds might generally need growing out longer than 7 weeks. More like 16 weeks.
There is good reasons to not want to harvest your bird before this also, so i am trying to tailor my breeding program to that time of grow out anyways.
But things can get busy at time can slip away and 'how old are dem roosters we hatched again?' Anyone who has harvested a rooster above 20 weeks in general will tell you that its gunna take some fixing or they wont be tender, rather chewy and sometimes so much so, you'll not want to do that again.
Methods to fix such aside, i say, dont worry about it, grow them roosters out to 20 weeks and more if you like. In fact, thats what i do with plenty of mine, and here's why. When i harvest an animal i eventually process it into the cuts of meat that i want, ie: roasts, steaks, marinades, meat strips, cubes for kebabs and of course 'mince'. Here is where the older age really doesnt matter too much.
I always need mince, either for sausages or for patties or spagetti bog etc, and by growing out your farm bird longer, they do put on more weight for that purpose.
So if its legs and breasts or full birds or butterflied etc, harvest earlier, but if its mince, let that rooster grow out and then harvest them.
Hope that helps
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 20:02:59 GMT 10
Hi guys, i put straw into the nesting boxes of my birds but i use wood shavings on the floor.
Wood shavings are absolutely awesome! From memory its called 'the deep litter' process.
It completely deals with odours. The chooks love it, it soaks up excess moisture, the chooks will dig and scratch and have a blast. You only need a couple of inches on a dirt floor.
When it starts looking rough, dump another 2 inches on top and repeat.
The use of wood chips cuts down my work in cleaning coops massively! In fact, all i do is kick the wood chips back where they have scratched them up to a hole in the ground and or where chook poop has clustered (generally where they roost).
The best part of this however is that after a while i end up with a floor level a lot higher than before, and if anyone grows food you know how important it is to make dirt, especially rich dirt. I muck out the coop when this happens, and either throw the partially composted results onto a compost pile for further decomposition, or, i use it as a garden cover, like woodchips.
I have growns brilliant food from such all year round.
I visit a local kitchen maker and woodworker and swap a 6 pack of carlton draught for bags of the stuff. If he runs dry i purchase big bags of it.
I use this stuff as the flooring for raising all kinds of poultry in my brooders. I recently used this on pups as well (but didnt use that stuff for compost or growing food), and it is by far one of the handiest materials i have ever come across.
Give it a try and let me know how things go, hope that helps, cheers.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 19:48:46 GMT 10
what! You bet. My young daughter brought me two poached eggs fresh from some of my free ranging hens once. It was followed by this comment 'Dad, there was something on the eggs when i pulled them out of the boiling water'. Suspicious i asked her to show me. What i saw horrified me! It looked like someone left a good few strands of 2 minute noodles in the boiling water. I knew instantly they were worms, as these worms i am familiar with from other animals. But i had never even heard if such was possible. So i jumped online and started learning. Apparently its rare, check out this fella's vid of one he found in his STORE BOUGHT EGGS!! for a visual. Be aware, they can be a lot smaller than this also., just like a white hair even so crack a heap of eggs your going to cook and examine now and then. Knowing this was both annoying, off putting to eating eggs as well as scary, but at the same time liberating. The reason it was liberating was because i had had the odd sick grow out bird id hatched, and or working rooster that just lost weight and died. I had no clue from what at the time, no noticeable sign of such, but suddenly i had a lead. Someone has worms and its passing to the flocks. What i found was that a few of my bird had the worms, and these worms can get into the eggs and grow from there. My remedy is this, and once again. As a learner and sometimes fella who really has no clue, i am not against the nasty stuff (chemical store bought stuff), but please, try not to use that stuff until youve tried natural remedies. No harm in trying i say, and rather use nature to fix nature so to speak. I used a few good teaspoons of ground Cayene pepper into the blender, with a few cloves of minced garlic, 250ml of apple cider vinegar with the mother, chilli seeds, diatomaceous earth, ginger, and pumpkin seeds. Blend it, and add it to feed but make sure they eat the whole thing. The birds dont have the same receptors to the heat of the chilli and stuff we do, but they certainly snort and shake but cant stop eating it lol. I then watched one of my birds poop out a massive turd the next day in the rain with a big stringy worm in it. The concoction worked! at least for me! But then another bird saw the worm moving and ate the thing! far out! So i realized, chooks will be bug and worm predators and i love them so, but that i needed to keep this up to flush them out. So i kept it up for a week, feeding them this again and again. Once again, prevention is better than cure. I would recommend in your farm diary you seek to worm them with such every month. If your birds are running around and having fun naturally, chances are they will get them, so keep onto it and let me know how you go. Hopefully this will help avoid the chemical stuff and help your flock, cheers.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 19:25:56 GMT 10
Hi again, just trying to contribute as much as i can and of which i have found work for me over the years as areas are and conditions vary differently for animal husbandry and homesteading.
I recall when living in qld years ago, until of course i found God's country 'Victoria' (haha) some of my egg layers were infested with lice. First time id ever seen this, so i went out and got the nasty stuff and got it all over them and it fixed the problem.
Now, im all for avoiding the nasty stuff and going natural as much as you can, but as a homesteader prepper i have got to say guys, i am not against the vet and or some of what i class as the nasty chemical stuff. After all is said and done, its my last resort to vaccinate or use such, but i have failed in both my knowledge and experience at times. That said back to it.
My best answer for animal husbandry homesteading/gardening is to strive to be ahead of problems if you can and implement prevention BEFORE you see an issue. I am always looking to nature to see how best to deal with things.
Chooks naturally love to dust bath, and if you have a wood fire, youll have plenty of wood ash available to put in a corner of the coop for them to mess it all up. The fine wood ash (the light grey stuff) chokes mites. Ive used diatomaceous earth for such and havent had as much success with it as i have had with the fine wood ash at keeping my chooks free from mites.
Mites will upset the bird and it will affect its behaviour, weight, and egg production, so get fine wood ash into a corner for their dust bathing regularly.
If you dont have a wood fire, make a small fire like in a chimineya or steel drum and burn it down to create some. You can get some fine wire and pour the contents out onto it to filter the finer dust from the charcoal as well. And dont forget, you can add the charcoal to your compost as well as your wood ash too.
If you have had mites, its best to clean out their nesting boxes and clean up hard, then get the dust into the works. Your chooks will love you for it and i hope it works for you as it has for me.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 19:13:03 GMT 10
Where in Vic are you mate?
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 19:11:55 GMT 10
Ive got the US Army field survival manual 21 on edible and medicinal foods which has some in it that we have here, but its too big to load here unfortunately.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 19:05:49 GMT 10
I'll second pigs for plowing! Or maybe we should call it destroying lol
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 19:04:17 GMT 10
Hi guys, i am selling a block where ive raised dual purpose birds for some time and thus scaling down my flock and genetics. I have brought home some of my 1st, 2nd and 3rd generation birds and sold a lot of them since. I have 4 3rd gen hens just into POL (point of lay) brought home to my urban home and laying strong presently. I have 1st and 2nd gen birds, plus some throw ins for adding specifics of genetics in another coop and they are all laying strong at present and of course i needed a rooster, but how in suburbia with that crow? I have brought home one of my young roosters who has been crowing for weeks. 1 rooster can tread 15 girls so its a good ratio to understand when into raising broilers for a strong meat supply. I use a velcro strip no more than 10cms wide, and fit it low on the roosters neck, underneath the neck feathers. It needs to be tight, probably tighter than you will do it at first, so experiment with it. What this does is chokes the roosters intake of air necessary for crowing, which is more air than for its general breathing and being happy. The crow should sound like something is being murdered lol, and the noise level very low. You might need to adjust accordingly if you hear the bird crowing louder than usual (tighten it), or if the bird is clearly not able to breathe (loosen it). My rooster is as happy as larry! You cant see the velcro, and he does his business with his ladies accordingly. Heres a few pics and hope that helps, give it a try and post how you went.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 18:52:00 GMT 10
Awesome post, i love chooks, and chicken and eggs and their work ethic. Lots to learn about them and i recommend them as the preppers friend when done right and an ultimate pet for kids.
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token
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Post by token on Oct 22, 2016 18:47:33 GMT 10
Quails are easy to harvest, cut the head off, the wings and legs at the stump, press in hard on the chest and skin, cut the backbone straight up and gut, wash and set aside, do another...bout 22 seconds a bird.
Meat tastes great. However, you need to selectively breed them to get them bigger, and there is a limit on the species of jap quail size. Currently, i can get you well over 300 grams of meat quail.
Eggs are seasonal, unlike many breeds of chicken.
Feed can be an issue and the Achilles heel if you raise them where they cannot free range. Lots to tell, happy to help and supply good genetics for folk who want to learn from our story there.
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