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Post by hillbilly on Jan 18, 2019 14:53:12 GMT 10
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Pion
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Post by Pion on Jan 18, 2019 16:37:02 GMT 10
Thankyou...I will enjoy studying this...
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remnantprep
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Post by remnantprep on Jan 18, 2019 20:39:39 GMT 10
Thank you for sharing Hillbilly. Just so you are aware Ausprep is in contact with he writer of this Thesis and he has contributed to this forum.
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remnantprep
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Post by remnantprep on Jan 18, 2019 20:41:34 GMT 10
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Post by hillbilly on Jan 20, 2019 8:46:51 GMT 10
I was not aware that he was a contributor here. It kinda irked me that our posts and opinions from aussurviv were used (permission??)in making him a doctor of philosophy. Not disrespecting the field of philosophy, but his use of info from total unknown persons was used , assuming that info to be credible, then analysed, and presented as his study. There was a constant supply of trolls at aussurv with silly, Hollywood inspired fantasies. Yet these might have been included in his random selection. Again, no disrespect to him or his field, but his analysis was, I feel, disrespectful to those genuine members who he chose to copy/paste and label as "radicalised" Just my thoughts,
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remnantprep
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People do not exist for the sake of governments!
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Post by remnantprep on Jan 20, 2019 10:00:53 GMT 10
I understand how that would have been irksome to you hillbilly. He is working to open up the idea of being prepared to the general public and here is the thread where we are introduced to Mr Henry, it may help to understand where he is coming from. OH and welcome to the forum to . ausprepforum.proboards.com/thread/5177/aussie-preppers-show-kits
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Post by SA Hunter on Jan 20, 2019 10:27:27 GMT 10
I was not aware that he was a contributor here. It kinda irked me that our posts and opinions from aussurviv were used (permission??)in making him a doctor of philosophy. Not disrespecting the field of philosophy, but his use of info from total unknown persons was used , assuming that info to be credible, then analysed, and presented as his study. There was a constant supply of trolls at aussurv with silly, Hollywood inspired fantasies. Yet these might have been included in his random selection. Again, no disrespect to him or his field, but his analysis was, I feel, disrespectful to those genuine members who he chose to copy/paste and label as "radicalised" Just my thoughts, Hi hillbilly Simon was pretty open with us here, about what he was doing, and why. In private conversations with him, one thing I picked up was that he was trying to get away from the, as you say, "trolls with silly Hollywood inspired fantasies". I think his latest tv piece on the Project, was pretty level headed, showing survivalists in a more positive light-though I think there is a huge difference between a Survivalist and a Prepper. Not sure if he used our posts and opinions here ( have only just started to read his paper ), but yes, "whacky" posts make for good publicity. The problem is, these places are public forums, and what people see, people can use. Honestly, I'd take up your concerns with him in a private message.
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Pion
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Post by Pion on Jan 20, 2019 13:16:58 GMT 10
I was not aware that he was a contributor here. It kinda irked me that our posts and opinions from aussurviv were used (permission??)in making him a doctor of philosophy. Not disrespecting the field of philosophy, but his use of info from total unknown persons was used , assuming that info to be credible, then analysed, and presented as his study. There was a constant supply of trolls at aussurv with silly, Hollywood inspired fantasies. Yet these might have been included in his random selection. Again, no disrespect to him or his field, but his analysis was, I feel, disrespectful to those genuine members who he chose to copy/paste and label as "radicalised" Just my thoughts, My thought is you will enjoy this site if you dont like the Aussurv trolls...I not only participate here but run the prepnz site...I dont abide idiots well and have found most radicals a) have no spine when confronted with facts and b) are lazy and dont see the long game...sounds like politicians really... Anyway I thought the presentation was done in a balanced fashion and that is what you want...dare I say I've found Prepping in Aussie (by population numbers) somewhat subdued compared to NZ (there's a cat amongst the pigeons!) however we dont seem to tolerate (within our own) the radicals any less...unfortunately the media still need to sell their wares and will always give the 'loud & crazy' airtime...
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Post by hillbilly on Jan 20, 2019 19:43:02 GMT 10
Hey guys, It's great that people are nice and open with us, But it doesn't fix the fact that you will assume that anyone who could be self promoting and using a survival site to achieve their own goals, can and will, use members and those members posts to advance these goals. That ain't cool man. Please don't become sucked in by glitz and glamorous promises. "...Being prepared to the general public..." Really? That ain't gunna go well. It's australia 2019, most taxpaying units are watching the footy. His offer of bringing survivalism into the mainstream is a feeble grab of your approval. Feeble grab of your approval. YOUR approval. Salesman. So if you wanna be feebly grabbed, you probably have been. No one can declare they are an " authority" on the subject, until they have walked the walk. This academic is an authority due to his study of a website, lol,lol,lol,...he studied some posts and became an authority Sorry guys, but this dude is a "wanna be" but with limited idea. God bless, and goodnight.
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Jan 20, 2019 20:41:12 GMT 10
I did previously make the point that a person who has studied pepping so much but does no preps himself, is not very smart. He claims to be an independent authority. So not influenced by the so called pepping culture, but gives an independent objective study..
I have an issues calling prepping a culture. I have no issues with anyone using posts on an open forum, they need to be in context, and a thesis needs to reference and acknowledge the source.
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Post by Peter on Jan 20, 2019 21:55:43 GMT 10
This is a large part of why I have little respect for academics; I've lost count of the number of times I've been told what/how/when to do something by someone who's had no practical experience of the task at hand. But they read a few papers on the topic and then wrote their own dissertation (which generally doesn't hold water in the real world).
With all that said & done, if he's trying to make preparedness less weird to the masses, good on him.
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Post by heisenberg on Jan 24, 2019 11:10:03 GMT 10
Hi Hillbilly,
yep, this is an old discussion (old news, as you put it). Here are the highlights from a couple of previous discussions, which address some of the points you (and others) have raised in this thread:
My PhD Thesis - What I Did and Why I Did it (in a very small nut-shell): Regarding Australian Survivalism: I conducted a three-year critical analysis of forty-eight thousand eight-hundred and eighty-five (48885) publicly presented discussion forum posts, created by one hundred and twenty-five (125) Australian Survivalists. Read the Methodology Chapter of my Thesis (in full) if you want to know exactly how I did it. The 90,000-word thesis, in its entirety, was assessed by three senior academics (who work in the field of security studies) on three different continents [North America, Europe (UK) and Australia] and the degree was awarded, after what amounted to a nine-month process of review. All aspects of the thesis, including its methodology and conclusions were assessed as well-founded. So, it’s a bit simplistic to say that I copied and pasted a couple of forum posts, called some people radicals and that in some way granted me a doctorate degree.
My PhD presented new information which contributed to an academic debate in the field of International Security Studies (The Debate: arguments around the concept of ‘non-violent radicalisation’) but as a by-product it can also be used to support / validate the Australian Survivalist life-style choice. My thesis in no way threatens the Sub-Culture, in fact it supports Australian Survivalists in a way that has never been done before and I stand by the results that allow me (or any one of you) to speak against the dangerous Survivalist stereotypes, which only serve to feed the fear of the ill-informed public.
Concerning Some of the Key Terms (and their definitions) Used in my Thesis:
Radicalisation - a behavioural and ideological development process. Note well: ‘radicalisation’ in academia does not mean a definite movement towards violence (that’s the incorrectly used media ‘version’ of the word radicalisation).
Militant Survivalist - the word ‘Militant’ is a term used in the literal sense that identifies Survivalists who openly ‘advocate’ (promote / verbally support only) the use of violence against perceived threats. Note well: ‘Militant’ does not mean someone that has or will definitely engage in acts of real physical violence in our current social circumstances.
Concerning the Use of Internet Discussion Forum Content: Internet discussion forum content can be considered public text as it is deliberately presented in a public space. Forum members actively create public discussion posts (knowing that they have private communication options available to them) with the expectation that their publicly presented opinion may be read and responded to by other people. Bearing this in mind, it becomes reasonable that anyone may make full use of data that is deliberately and voluntarily made available in the public Internet domain and quote text where relevant. In all honesty, I can see how you may feel a little uncomfortable about me quoting you directly and I am sorry that you feel that way but we all know, if you stick it out there someone is going to use it. PM me if you want to discuss this further.
Concerning Australian Survivalists as a Sub-Culture: The Australian survivalist collective exists within the larger Australian mainstream cultural group. It possesses its own specific style of language, mode of interaction, behaviours and ideologies, which are often at variance with those of the mainstream. With these factors in mind, for all intents and purposes, Australian survivalists are representative of a sub-culture of the national mainstream cultural group and can (arguably) be acknowledged and referred to as such.
Walking the Walk: The first time I spoke to an Australian Survivalist, one on one, and discussed his beliefs and practices was in 1989. Since that time (nearly 30 years ago), I have had hundreds of direct conversations with numerous Survivalists from all walks of life.
While I was able to draw upon those 30 years of direct experiences with Survivalists and having access to people who could have directly provided more background than I actually needed for my thesis, conducting interviews with Survivalist sample subjects was deemed too risky, in terms of obtaining academically accepted ‘unbiased’ data. In the end, I had to do it the way I did to, [1] have the research undertaking initially accepted by the university, [2] have the thesis approved for the award of the degree, by three international assessors, and [3] to be able to put the Australian Survivalist Sub-Culture subject on the mainstream table and talk about it from a position of ‘socially accepted’ (external / unbiased) authority.
My dissertation is an ‘academic’ work and nothing in it comes with a simple explanation. In its entirety, my research supports the position that as long as Australian Survivalists are engaging in the activities and thought processes of their current Survivalist life-style (reflected in the identified development pathway), it is unlikely that they will become a violent extremist risk. Good news for all Australian Survivalists, in terms of changing public perception.
Promises, Promises! I have made no ‘glitz and glamorous’ promises. What I can promise is, when I am called to provide Australian Survivalist-related information to media interests (and there is no doubt now that I will be wheeled out every time one of them wants to run a Prepper story) is that I can speak to my research results; which firmly support that the Australian Survivalist Sub-Culture is not Right-Wing, does not want to actively contribute to the end of the world and is unlikely to become a violent domestic extremist risk. Am I promoting myself while simultaneously presenting the Australian Survivalist Sub-Culture in a sensible and more realistic light than it has ever been done before? - Absolutely! I’m an academic, that’s part of the job. I would hope that you can see this as an inconsequential necessity crucial to putting me in a position that I am able to positively speak about the Sub-Culture (which is good for you). Additionally, I am ‘talking the talk’ by openly and publicly (putting my name, face and all out there) doing exactly what I said I would do. A couple of media engagements so far, including a prime-time TV show and more coming up.
Thanks Hillbilly. Please PM me if you want to discuss any of this further.
Kindest regards,
Simon.
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Post by hillbilly on Jan 29, 2019 9:36:59 GMT 10
like I had said." use of info from total unknown persons was used , assuming that info to be credible, then analysed, and presented as his study. There was a constant supply of trolls at aussurv with silly, Hollywood inspired fantasies. Yet these might have been included in his random selection." assuming that info to be truth, credible, biased? your thesis is built around sketchy data. and another thought on your statement,.."In its entirety, my research supports the position that as long as Australian Survivalists are engaging in the activities and thought processes of their current Survivalist life-style (reflected in the identified development pathway), it is unlikely that they will become a violent extremist risk." so youre saying that survivalists in aus are tame, as long as they keep going as they are. lol, "unlikely to become violent" unlikely, means "possibility" exists. that's not helping. imo violent exremism doesn't enter the equation, yet you make reference to it as a possibility. maybe its just me, but i cant see that helping. why do people think that survival awareness needs to become mainstream . you said, " I am ‘talking the talk’ ..." i agree
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Pion
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Post by Pion on Jan 29, 2019 9:57:47 GMT 10
Good argument Hill!...
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Post by hillbilly on Jan 30, 2019 7:00:59 GMT 10
I appreciate your reply Simon, but it doesn't clear much up. In your reply paragraphs titled "walk the walk", there is no mention of anything actually done re survival activities. "walk the walk" kinda implies that a person matches their words with doing something related to those words. Seems to me that you "talked" about someone elses walk. I also don't get your logic "... conducting interviews with Survivalist sample subjects was deemed too risky, in terms of obtaining academically accepted ‘unbiased’ data. In the end, I had to do it the way I did ..." so you then accepted the posts from a public forum. this was a WTF moment for me. lol
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frostbite
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Post by frostbite on Jan 30, 2019 7:52:41 GMT 10
I was Case Study 1, the star of Mr Henry's thesis I get where you're coming from Hillbilly, but I also get that if Simon had tried to interview survivalists for his research he would have either been told where to go in no uncertain terms, or the responses would have been carefully crafted to present an image that might not have been accurate. There is still the issue with the sample group being less than honest or deliberately vague in their forum posts that the thesis was based on. Some of the stuff people wrote on Ausurv was fantasy land, by people who were actually just pretenders. Hopefully the size of the sample group and the period of time over which the survey was conducted makes this issue negligible to the overall result. I was the first to discover this thesis and bring it to the attention of the wider survivalist community. I still believe a more palatable word than 'radicalisation' should have been used, because of the common association by non academics of this word to terrorism, but overall Simon has shown himself in two media pieces since as a supportive voice of reason for us. I still believe Simon's Pathway of progression to radicalisation' is too rigid to accurately portray every survivalist's prepping journey, but at the end of the day Simon is supportive of us as a sub-culture and has become the recognised subject matter 'expert' by the media and perhaps even government and law enforcement in this country. I think we need influential friends like him.
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norseman
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Post by norseman on Jan 30, 2019 11:14:02 GMT 10
I was Case Study 1, the star of Mr Henry's thesis Your deviant predations upon numerous store mannequins should be grounds for removal from the number 1 position! Don't be fooled folks, we have a sick puppy here! From injection moulded plastic through to clear polyethylene and on to full blown fibreglass, black, white or brown he has committed serious offences! If it has fully rotating arms and legs and stands in a display window Frosty will jump on it!
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frostbite
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Post by frostbite on Jan 30, 2019 11:42:22 GMT 10
Who wants to see photos?
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Post by hillbilly on Jan 30, 2019 12:09:51 GMT 10
I still believe a more palatable word than 'radicalisation' should have been used, because of the common association by non academics of this word to terrorism, ... even academics would think "terrorism" when asked to consider "radicalisation" in these times. was the word chosen to shock the reader, therefore to gain interest in the piece?
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frostbite
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Post by frostbite on Jan 30, 2019 14:30:33 GMT 10
This cutie is my all time favourite. I used to have lunch with her daily when I was based in southern Sydney:
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