spatial
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Post by spatial on Feb 16, 2023 17:50:07 GMT 10
Family of 4 BOB ready to go, definitely ex military flavour.
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Post by spinifex on Feb 18, 2023 18:22:45 GMT 10
The BOB is a different category ... the inventory that gets one through several days to several weeks isn't the same as what keeps one going for many years.
When I think INCH I think having the essentials to enable ongoing acquisition of water, food, shelter and defences.
From what I've read from people who have "lived it" a set of resources that enables a very high capability for improvisation and basic productivity is highly valuable. This is as true for people stuck in life rafts for many months as it is for people escaping from War/Occupation zones to 'start again'.
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Feb 18, 2023 18:44:41 GMT 10
The BOB is a different category ... the inventory that gets one through several days to several weeks isn't the same as what keeps one going for many years. When I think INCH I think having the essentials to enable ongoing acquisition of water, food, shelter and defences. From what I've read from people who have "lived it" a set of resources that enables a very high capability for improvisation and basic productivity is highly valuable. This is as true for people stuck in life rafts for many months as it is for people escaping from War/Occupation zones to 'start again'. It is a never coming home bag (INCH), leaving your residence never to return. Long term wilderness survival bag, would be pretty much the same except for seed and livestock.
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Post by spinifex on Feb 18, 2023 20:21:38 GMT 10
I can't sit through a 21 minute video like this. They guy needs to sharpen the messaging.
To me it looks more like a 3 month camping expedition kit ... not enough long term durable, repairable/maintainable and re-purposable content for my taste. I wouldn't want a tent that might last for 12 months of continuous use when I could have a truck tarp or Dam liner that can last 20+ years of continuous use. That saw he had ... I don't think that has the kind of blade that is made for heavy use and continual re-sharpening. Did he have a saw blade sharpening set?
A kit taken on a truly remote and isolated setting with the expectation of lasting there in isolation for many years would need to have a different focus.
Anyway ... I think trying to stay in a hostile location for many decades is in a distant second place to making ones way to a friendlier country/continent and re-establishing there. And the INCH kit for that mission looks rather different indeed.
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tactile
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Post by tactile on Feb 19, 2023 17:11:16 GMT 10
I can't sit through a 21 minute video like this. They guy needs to sharpen the messaging. I think that's part of how their videos get monetised...it sucks huh? Their vids have to be a certain length to fit so many adds in or something, cant remember now. YouTube would take up about a tenth of the space and be 10 times more useful if people just got to the point.
I'm brutal with YouTube vids and have become expert at blasting through them (you get a feel for the useful info and where it is) with the forward arrow key. I double the speed of them too - your brain catches up pretty quick. No ads due to uBlock Origin helps too...
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Feb 19, 2023 22:02:47 GMT 10
I get where spinifex is coming from. As I stated in the beginning INCH bag is very unrealistic.
No one puts canvas in a bag, too heavy to carry, in Africa they build their shacks with cardboard and plastics bags. I would just take a roll of builders plastic, build a wooden cabin and use plastics for rainfall insulation. If one has insulation issues, road signs are excellent building material. Hacksaw with spare blades is a must, wherever one goes no matter how remote there are always old cars, bits of tin lying around that can be used for shelter.
It does depend on location/environment you are moving too. I watched a vid were a guy took a bag of stuff deep into Alaska slept in a rock overhang for 18 months, huge fire every night, even though winter. Outside of abandoned mining villages I have some caves that I have investigated for bugout. Majority of weight in BOB is focused on food procurement.
As to a saw sharpeners my leathernan has a removable sharpener, I also have some nail file type sharpeners. My BOB has cheap bunnings bow saw with 5 extra blades for each type of wood and spares, weight is very minimal. If the bow saw frame breaks you can always make a new one.
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malewithatail
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Post by malewithatail on Feb 20, 2023 7:09:19 GMT 10
spinifex said, "Anyway ... I think trying to stay in a hostile location for many decades is in a distant second place to making ones way to a friendlier country/continent and re-establishing there. And the INCH kit for that mission looks rather different indeed." A event that affects Australia so badly to require us to bug out, will be affecting the whole world, so there probably won't be any friendly country/continent to bug out to. The whole world will be affected. Think economic collapse and the subsequent rioting, and a nuke war. Yes, Australia will be less affected for a while, but there would be no where else to go, maybe Antarctica, but why bother ? Surviving by moving from place to place isn't living.
Perhaps the strategy should be to take out as many of the bad guys as possible before we get taken out.
Governments produce scarcity by shutting off pipelines, shutting down farming operations, taxing productivity and deliberately causing food shortages and inflation. Money printing steals savings from everyone, creating scarcity of the purchasing value of dollars previously earned.
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Post by spinifex on Feb 20, 2023 17:24:23 GMT 10
spinifex said, "Anyway ... I think trying to stay in a hostile location for many decades is in a distant second place to making ones way to a friendlier country/continent and re-establishing there. And the INCH kit for that mission looks rather different indeed." A event that affects Australia so badly to require us to bug out, will be affecting the whole world, so there probably won't be any friendly country/continent to bug out to. The whole world will be affected. Think economic collapse and the subsequent rioting, and a nuke war. Yes, Australia will be less affected for a while, but there would be no where else to go, maybe Antarctica, but why bother ? Surviving by moving from place to place isn't living.
Perhaps the strategy should be to take out as many of the bad guys as possible before we get taken out.
Governments produce scarcity by shutting off pipelines, shutting down farming operations, taxing productivity and deliberately causing food shortages and inflation. Money printing steals savings from everyone, creating scarcity of the purchasing value of dollars previously earned. Give my regards to the invaders when they come to round you up. Before they put you in a ditch. It pays to learn from history about what actually happens on a recurrent basis. Global catastrophe for mankind has NEVER occurred. Even during Ice Ages (our biggest global challenge in the last 10 000 years) it was possible to migrate out of the hostile living areas and into better places. You are alive because Your ancestors did exactly that. In more recent times ... If my Prussian ancestors could have a re-do of 1944-48 ... all would have left their homes for good in 1944 and escaped Soviet genocide. A lot of them perished attempting to try to maintain life in their familiar surroundings. The Soviets didn't control the globe ... there were oodles of friendlier places to re-establish. The same is true of Oz. They who invade will not be occupying the entire planet.
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tactile
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Post by tactile on Feb 20, 2023 18:16:50 GMT 10
Wonder how many here are post WW2 European immigrants? Spinifex, Frostbite, anyone else? Nothing nefarious, just wondering are people from that background more wary of the world than others?
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frostbite
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Post by frostbite on Feb 20, 2023 19:44:32 GMT 10
My take on this topic is our own government is a more likely threat to our standard of living than an invading army. How do you migrate away from that?
NZ, Canada, USA, France, UK just more of the same. Russia perhaps if you like extreme cold and want to be cannon fodder in the Ukraine. Germany perhaps if you are okay with your women folk being raped by third world Muslim refugees. Same same most of the Scandinavian countries. Either of the Koreas? No thanks. Italy bankrupt, Greece bankrupt.
Got any other ideas?
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Feb 20, 2023 19:46:18 GMT 10
Australia is big a continent it cannot all be occupied. An invading force would not worry about a few vagrants living in the remote outback's. Take over the few industries and large cities.Watch the movie Defiance based on a truestory where 3 brothers escape into the Belarusian Forrest, and are joined by many other escapees in WW2.
The black plauge killed over a third of populations of Europe and North Africa there was little escape. Today we live in globalised world all systems banking, financial, medical, fertiliser internet are all integrated the collapse will be global. Just like Covid19 and bird flue, no one place will be safe.
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tactile
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Post by tactile on Feb 20, 2023 20:16:21 GMT 10
Sign up for Artemis (Moon) or hitch a ride with Elon to Mars?
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norseman
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Post by norseman on Feb 20, 2023 23:14:08 GMT 10
My take on this topic is our own government is a more likely threat to our standard of living than an invading army. How do you migrate away from that? NZ, Canada, USA, France, UK just more of the same. Russia perhaps if you like extreme cold and want to be cannon fodder in the Ukraine. Germany perhaps if you are okay with your women folk being raped by third world Muslim refugees. Same same most of the Scandinavian countries. Either of the Koreas? No thanks. Italy bankrupt, Greece bankrupt. Got any other ideas? If you had say one or two million US in the bank then Argentina / Chile would be a nice option! Disappear in Patagonia, buy a little estancia there!
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frostbite
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Post by frostbite on Feb 21, 2023 4:02:07 GMT 10
Problem with South America is the violence. There’s heaps of footage of random brutal killings online from there.
Australia is still probably the best option. And if a foreign power invades and slaughters loads of spineless victims then that’s probably a good thing for our gene pool. Beats me why more civilians didn’t take up arms and become partisans during WW2. Better to die fighting than burned to death whimpering in a barn.
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norseman
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Post by norseman on Feb 21, 2023 6:50:49 GMT 10
Problem with South America is the violence. There’s heaps of footage of random brutal killings online from there. Australia is still probably the best option. And if a foreign power invades and slaughters loads of spineless victims then that’s probably a good thing for our gene pool. Beats me why more civilians didn’t take up arms and become partisans during WW2. Better to die fighting than burned to death whimpering in a barn. Yes in cities like Buenos Aries there are many "no go areas" mostly on the periphery. In the considerable amount of time I spent there I witnessed some violence here and there but no worse than Sydney CBD on a Saturday night. Places like Patagonia and other Regional Areas such as Province of Mendoza are very safe but still need to use caution just like here.
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Post by spinifex on Feb 21, 2023 7:53:57 GMT 10
Australia is big a continent it cannot all be occupied. An invading force would not worry about a few vagrants living in the remote outback's. Take over the few industries and large cities.Watch the movie Defiance based on a truestory where 3 brothers escape into the Belarusian Forrest, and are joined by many other escapees in WW2. The black plauge killed over a third of populations of Europe and North Africa there was little escape. Today we live in globalised world all systems banking, financial, medical, fertiliser internet are all integrated the collapse will be global. Just like Covid19 and bird flue, no one place will be safe. I agree. It can't all be occupied. But it can be surveilled pretty well with modern tech - the probability of being detected and investigated must be pretty high. The Lykovs were found in the early 70's with much lower remote sensing tech than exists today. An invading force would not worry about vagrants living in remote regions ... but they would likely hunt them for sport just like we hunt deer, feral camels and buffalo. They'll do it because they like it ... not because they must.
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malewithatail
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Post by malewithatail on Feb 21, 2023 11:41:45 GMT 10
spatial said "The black plague killed over a third of populations of Europe and North Africa there was little escape. Today we live in globalized world all systems banking, financial, medical, fertilizer internet are all integrated the collapse will be global. Just like Covid19 and bird flue, no one place will be safe."
My thoughts exactly. No where will be safe, we have to make our location as safe as possible. The whole world is interlocked more so than at any other time in history. In WW2 there were a few places that one could escape to to get away from the war, but now with economy's, stock markets, supply chains and so on, so interlocked, there is no where that wont be affected by a economic collapse, stock marked crash or a world war. True there will be isolated things like tsunamis and earthquakes, volcanoes, train derailments that release toxic substances, etc, but these are relatively localized events.
Australia doesn't have a lot of native animals to enable a population to live from the land, so staying put and defending what you have may be the only option. You physically can't carry enough supplies to last say 6 months off the grid, perhaps towing a small hand cart may work, but that's limiting as to where u can go. A suitably equipped BOV may work, but once again where to go ? An amphibious vehicle and head off to a tropical island ?
“There would be little chance of recovery to pre-nuclear-war conditions in an impoverished and devastated world.”
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Feb 21, 2023 11:43:21 GMT 10
Problem with South America is the violence. There’s heaps of footage of random brutal killings online from there. Australia is still probably the best option. And if a foreign power invades and slaughters loads of spineless victims then that’s probably a good thing for our gene pool. Beats me why more civilians didn’t take up arms and become partisans during WW2. Better to die fighting than burned to death whimpering in a barn. Yes in cities like Buenos Aries there are many "no go areas" mostly on the periphery. In the considerable amount of time I spent there I witnessed some violence here and there but no worse than Sydney CBD on a Saturday night. Places like Patagonia and other Regional Areas such as Province of Mendoza are very safe but still need to use caution just like here. There is nowhere left to hide, I bugged out of Africa - now have a house on east coast, just this week rented a 1 bedroom cottage in a very remote area close to my work (Company house on a much larger property), That is my alternate Bug out location, no intention of leaving the country. North Canada is the best places to go if you want total isolation and free from any perceived invading force. No way an invading force will have the resource and time to go deep outback Australia/Canada. China has it's own problems with Korea, Japan, India and Taiwan. India by itself could cripple China. The south China sea area has never been ruled by a single country, to diverse and too many balancing forces. Japan has a huge demographic problem with ageing population, and are expediting immigration by professionals. You can even get a free house bit suspect journalism! Some places in Aus they are offering free land in rural communities that are collapsing.. Japan enters the global immigration war; plans new visa pathways to attract high earners, top gradseconomictimes.indiatimes.com/nri/migrate/japan-enters-the-global-immigration-war-plans-new-visa-pathways-to-attract-high-earners-top-grads/articleshow/98047120.cmsJapan has announced that it will establish a new, simplified immigration pathways for high-income earners and graduates of high-ranking foreign universities as the global race for talented workers intensifies. The new immigration pathways, to be implemented in April following a public comment process, are called the Japan System for Special Highly Skilled Professionals (J-Skip) and the Japan System for Future Creation Individual Visa (J-Find). There are more than 8 million empty homes in rural Japan, and local governments are selling them for as little as $500 in a bid to lure residentswww.insider.com/japanese-government-selling-rural-homes-cheap-akiya-banks-2021-5
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malewithatail
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Post by malewithatail on Feb 21, 2023 12:29:35 GMT 10
Places like Northern Canada would not be suitable for long survival stays as the growing season is so short and it gets soooo cold. I think us Aussies would freeze to death in that climate anyway !
If 500 million Chinese, or even Indians suddenly decided they wanted Australia, we couldn't stop them anyway, even with USA help.
Definition of democracy 1:when the elites choose two puppets for you to vote for and you get f....d either way.
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spatial
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Post by spatial on Feb 21, 2023 13:33:38 GMT 10
Places like Northern Canada would not be suitable for long survival stays as the growing season is so short and it gets soooo cold. I think us Aussies would freeze to death in that climate anyway ! If 500 million Chinese, or even Indians suddenly decided they wanted Australia, we couldn't stop them anyway, even with USA help. Definition of democracy 1:when the elites choose two puppets for you to vote for and you get f....d either way. India and China are already on low level skirmish on their shared border. China will be overstretched by the time they get to Aus. If one has enough weapons and well trained soldiers one can hold back a superior force. Ukraine is hammering Russia with intel from the west and western arms. Russia with one of the world larges land based armies. I am convinced, economic collapse, hot wars all over the globe, food shortages, EMP nukes and natural disaster are on the cards and just around the corner. The entitled western citizen will riot and destroy their counties demanding what the gov will no longer be able to give. I am also thinking high tech satellite and surveillance will be down. The US and West are not totally defenseless. China will have their hands full with Japan, India & Taiwan. One nuke or convectional weapon on the three gorges dam in China will just about cripple the county. China is not invincible. Modern warfare is ordinance delivery systems, number of men are not key element. Drone and robot wars. China has capacity to make a lot of drones etc.. it could be bad.
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