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Post by Joey on Mar 15, 2021 8:46:46 GMT 10
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bug
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Post by bug on Mar 15, 2021 17:55:08 GMT 10
That's good, but where are the SE asian navies in this? Too busy bickering with each other to stand together against a greater threat it seems.
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Post by milspec on Mar 15, 2021 20:37:44 GMT 10
That's good, but where are the SE asian navies in this? Too busy bickering with each other to stand together against a greater threat it seems. I dont think China really gives a toss if SE Asian navies (other than India) try to conduct right of passage transits through the South China Sea. |
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Post by milspec on Mar 16, 2021 9:31:29 GMT 10
I see China has increased its "reported" defence spending yet again, as it has done year on year this past decade. I believe their defence budget has effectively doubled in that time.
I'm sure nothing bad will come from those efforts to massively build up its military. 🤔
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Post by Joey on Mar 16, 2021 9:35:02 GMT 10
Considering that the Chinese "Coast Guard" boats are larger than the largest boats of the Philippines, Thailand, Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia.
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frostbite
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Post by frostbite on Mar 16, 2021 12:34:29 GMT 10
It seems clear to me that the Chinese Navy is to stop other nations from interfering as they strip our oceans, the arctic and antarctic of resources.
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bug
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Post by bug on Mar 16, 2021 13:28:40 GMT 10
A swedish/Indo naval vessel sailing with a US carrier through waters that the CCP claims would be noticed by them for sure. A bit hard for the CCP to bully their neighbours in a situation like that.
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Post by spinifex on Mar 17, 2021 7:46:42 GMT 10
I see China has increased its "reported" defence spending yet again, as it has done year on year this past decade. I believe their defence budget has effectively doubled in that time. I'm sure nothing bad will come from those efforts to massively build up its military. 🤔 Whats worrisome about this is the likely effectiveness of the spend. When Russia or China spend a billion on their military heaps of new weapons are manufactured and deployed. And at least with Russia the systems seem effective and reliable. When Washington spends a billion ... no-one knows where it went! Although its a fair bet it probably ended up with Lockheed Martin executives as a "Performance Bonus" for finally delivering a still under-performing "low cost" F35. (Which now, itself, is being talked about as needing a 'low cost' alternative LOL.) I can see our future Air Combat going like this: "Um ... just a second mr 4th Gen Chinese jet fighter ... my 5th gen avionics system seems to have crashed and I'm waiting for it to report the error to microsoft" "Can we postpone this fight until they send through a patch?" "Damn ... the patch has caused a different software crash ... I'll have to get back to you when I'm ready to engage. I'll send you a Meeting request through Microsoft Teams!" |
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bug
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Post by bug on Mar 17, 2021 8:59:53 GMT 10
China's latest jet is a carbon copy of the US one. (Tries not to look too surprised).
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Post by milspec on Mar 17, 2021 12:39:15 GMT 10
China's latest jet is a carbon copy of the US one. (Tries not to look too surprised). Ive sometimes wondered if the yanks let the Chinese steal flawed copies of their plans noting that China invests so much effort in cyber espionage. Seems like a good idea since letting them build flawed copies of US tech would cause them to waste resources as well as having an inferior capability. |
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bug
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Post by bug on Mar 17, 2021 15:54:54 GMT 10
Give them a design with a fatal flaw that your equipment is able to exploit. Interesting theory. The US is renowned for never selling the 'full package' of their own equipment, even to their allies.
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Beno
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Post by Beno on Mar 17, 2021 16:18:36 GMT 10
There is a new fighter on the cards and will be put before US congress soon. Apparently it was developed in less than a year (yeah right) and borrows tech from a range of existing aircraft. Us gov would have determined the f35 as a failure and began work on an alternative a long time ago. If this is true Lockheed Martin should be crucified and made to pay back all the lost dollars spent on the f35.
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Post by spinifex on Mar 18, 2021 17:20:29 GMT 10
Lots of people like to believe that the Chinese military is a bunch of incompetent fools with 2nd rate equipment.
Much like people liked to believe the same of the Japanese military up until 1941.
Even if its true ... and it may be in part ... nasty surprises are an important feature of military actions. Anyone can throw up a nasty surprise.
The Japanese at Pearl Harbour.
The Japanese at Singapore
The Germans during Barbarossa.
The Russians at Stalingrad
The Boers in the early stages of the British invasion of South Africa.
Australian resistance in PNG.
Australian light horse mayhem in Palestine. (Lets be real ... that one surprised both sides!)
Non-state goat herders in New York.
Lets make certain we are capable of dishing them out and the other side isn't.
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Post by SA Hunter on Mar 18, 2021 18:27:08 GMT 10
Lots of people like to believe that the Chinese military is a bunch of incompetent fools with 2nd rate equipment. Much like people liked to believe the same of the Japanese military up until 1941. Even if its true ... and it may be in part ... nasty surprises are an important feature of military actions. Anyone can throw up a nasty surprise. The Japanese at Pearl Harbour. The Japanese at Singapore The Germans during Barbarossa. The Russians at Stalingrad The Boers in the early stages of the British invasion of South Africa. Australian resistance in PNG. Australian light horse mayhem in Palestine. (Lets be real ... that one surprised both sides!) Non-state goat herders in New York. Lets make certain we are capable of dishing them out and the other side isn't. NEVER underestimate the enemy - more for your list; Nth swedish in the Vietnam War Arab League V Israel multiple times |
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Post by spinifex on Mar 18, 2021 18:48:31 GMT 10
Oh ... and I came back to add the biggest surprise of all time:
USAF over Hiroshima.
A seemingly harmless silver speck humming across the sky at high altitude followed by oblivion.
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Post by milspec on Mar 18, 2021 21:21:22 GMT 10
A part of me thinks that China must suck because it resorts to stealing/cloning so much industrial & military technology... and part of me knows they have a robust cyber capability and they have developed & marketed the best drones and CCTV systems ( so they can lead in some tech fields) Its a big step from a drone & CCTV to a hyperspectral sensor system on a highly integrated & networked low observable combat UAV carrying effective weapons ... but the technological edge is probably being rapidly eroded.
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Post by spinifex on Mar 19, 2021 7:58:53 GMT 10
My concern is that western militaries are putting far too much faith in highly elaborate signals/comms/electronica dependent weapons systems.
If/when that capability can be broadly eliminated by some kind of new tech ... the game changes. Big time. It then becomes very mathmatical. He who has lots and lots of troops, well versed in using 'dumb' weapons ends up holding a big advantage.
Remember that virus that eventually made it into the Iranian nuclear facility and wrecked it? Well, given China is great at Cyber-stuff ... can they, with enough patience and persistence, spread something similar through the US/NATO/Oz military systems?
I'm pretty sure China demonstrated capability to kill satellites too a little while back. And Western military systems do love their satellite data feeds ...
Hmmmmm ....
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Post by Joey on Mar 19, 2021 10:36:31 GMT 10
Just read also this morn about the numpties at the helm of the ADF now drawing down on the defence reserves roles, removing historical unit names etc and making their role a more disaster relief role domestically, which is the SES's job.
Last I checked, we have a fairly woeful defence force in regards to the number of active personnel of pretty much every other developed 1st world country. If I was a decision-maker at the top, I would be running massive recruitment drives and pushing for recruiters to be based at every Centrelink office and make it mandatory that as part of the dole application you have to have a recruiter meeting at the Centrelink office.
Australias only real benefit going for it in regards to wartime action is our distance from anything, but China is slowly working on that with military staging posts all around the Pacific, oceanographic surveys of our coastlines and submarine action areas off the WA coast, as well as the development of long-range anti-ship/aircraft missiles that can reach further than anything reportedly in use by Aussie and US warships (not saying that there isn't classified tech already in use that can reach just as far)
One would think that considering the vast expanse of the Australian coastline that defence would have some serious patrol boats in the water as well as better air defence/interception capabilities stationed further north in the country instead of keeping the majority of the fighter/interception squadrons based south the of the tropic of Capricorn and relying a lot on the Jindalee radar system and an occasional flyover of an AWACS plane of the northern coasts, which if activated have used a good chunk of their fuel just getting up north before going into action
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malewithatail
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Post by malewithatail on Mar 19, 2021 16:39:34 GMT 10
Totally agree, as one who has done military service in the reserves, if you want the dole and are under say 45, then 6 months compulsory military service, not conscription, as its to get the dole. If you don't want to do military service, simple, no collect the dole. taught me to appreciate a rifle, care for myself and my mates, and be ready to defend the best country in the world. I took an oath to protect and defend Australia, and nothings changed even though I'm over 60 now.
Perhaps even the system that Switzerland has in every able bodied person must do 6 months training and keep a rifle in good condition at home, ready, may be an idea. Compulsory range practice every 6 months, all good fun. Ditto if you want to do Air Force or Navy training.
Oh dear, I'm dreaming again !!
As for China..............
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Post by Stealth on Mar 20, 2021 9:44:32 GMT 10
IMO, Forcing dole bludgers into service is the absolute WORST thing you could do during 'peace time'. Holy heck, the fall out would be shocking. Permanent forces who WANT to be there suddenly having to babysit an influx of dole bludgers who want nothing more than to not be there?
You'd spend all of your time chasing admin action and charges for AWOL. No. Thanks.
Give them the option to serve, sure. But tell them they have to? I can't imagine anything worse. The amount of people who'd come out better for it would pale in comparison to the less-than minimum wage earner who has no appreciable skills and has to be trained in how to walk in a straight line. Let alone becoming a skilled tradesman/woman. They don't want to be there, they never even considered serving, and their default setting to any kind of authority is "NAH YOU CAN'T MAKE ME DO NUFFIN, BRO".
Unfortunately you can say 'force them to do it or put them in jail' but Holsworthy only holds so many miscreants. Unless you want to build a jail on every single base, you're going to find the impost far outweighs the gains before you can even blink. And then on top of it you're suddenly flooding your forces with people who are potential risks for bribery/honey traps/handing out information purely because they're pissed about being forced to be there, and you're basically handing information to the 'big bads' on a silver platter.
Conscription during war time is different. There'd be a huge amount of people don't want to be there, but they don't have enough time to piss around. They'd be stuffed into uniforms and thrown out onto the dirt before they even really know what's happening. Bit hard to go to the strippers and assault civie patrons when you're on a tinny/bugsmasher heading over to the front.
Now if war were to break out tomorrow, my opinion would probably be very different because again. It's real hard to be breaking laws and smashing jaws on your own patch if you're slogging through a swamp somewhere waiting to be lit up. But in peace time? Nah, I can't see that working out well.
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Jul 7, 2024 11:02:41 GMT 10
Jul 7, 2024 11:02:41 GMT 10
